THRIVE: What on Earth Will It Take?

THRIVE: What on Earth Will It Take?From the authors: THRIVE is an unconventional documentary that lifts the veil on what's "really" going on in our world by following the money upstream - uncovering the global consolidation of power in nearly every aspect of our lives.

Weaving together breakthroughs in science, consciousness and activism, THRIVE offers real solutions, empowering us with unprecedented and bold strategies for reclaiming our lives and our future.

From the Odyssey Magazine: THRIVE is more than a documentary relevant to the times. It is more than a well-researched and alarming insight into who really controls how the world works.

It is a recipe and blueprint for how we can, each and every one of us, thrive in the way that the rest of nature does – easily, naturally and with expansive grace. For this last point alone, it is more than worth the time to see.

Watch the full documentary now

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Ratings: 6.88/10 from 118 users.

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Comments and User Reviews

  • arightcharlie

    nah, sorry was bored at two minutes at 5 I'm thinking oh just get on with it then credits at 7 minutes???? and the promise of a two screen two hour powerpoint presentation???? someone watch this please and tell me it's fabulous-

  • Derek Styles

    yes it is...and quite nicely done :P

  • Teddy Mcd

    @ arightcharlie

    I agree.

    Although it appears interesting I too will wait for other comments from the crew.

  • dewflirt

    Is this going to end up in Atlantis or ancient aliens? Is 15 minutes (skipped the first 5) to early to be so sceptical? Why does this feel so similar to the Water doc? Think the top doc science bods must be influencing me! :)
    Edit, it's sun gods, oh dear :(

  • dewflirt

    OK I take it back, totally convinced by the crop circles ! ;)

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/John-Jacquard/1210162491 John Jacquard

    it might be easier to watch the whole film, then assume if you must. i'm just throwing a whacky idea out i'm not judging

  • Earthwinger

    I got as far as the mention of extraterrestrials before I hit the stop button. Would it be a bit harsh of me to call BS on this doc, without having watched it in it's entirety? Possibly yes, but five minutes of Nassim Haramein is about as much as I can take. I'm no physicist, but I reckon I can spot a wholefood sandal wearing charlatan when I see one. I don't buy into that guy for one minute, so I'm gonna call BS on him as well. Yeah, I'm in that kinda mood today! :D

    I think there's a serious problem with docs like this. I've nothing in particular against documentaries that focus on touchy-feely cosmic kookiness. If people want to get their rocks off with that kind of silliness....no problem, it's generally harmless. I can't help but feel though, that when they try to align their nuttiness with real social and environmental issues, there's a risk that those issues could become tainted by association.

    Meh.....I just don't trust Foster Gamble. Maybe I'm being unfair again, but my instincts are screaming at me that he's not to be trusted. He's got that smug look about him, like a tortoise enjoying the smell of it's own farts, plus he's got that cold, dead look in his eyes, reminiscent of H.W. Bush. :D

  • http://nanotaboada.myopenid.com/ Nano Taboada

    Don't be that anxious, it's worth every minute.

  • dewflirt

    You made me chuckle, i could manage two hours of science and I can manage two hours of fantastical nonsense but this is one pretending to be the other and I don't much care for being lied to. Good call wings, bs and thoroughly untrustworthy :)

  • Guest

    I stopped at 5:00 minutes not because i didn't like what i saw but because i liked what i saw. The computer art on the first minute, and the photography on the following 4. Within the first few words, i agree the guy looks like Bush but to me he is his opposite, a Bush that comes across as an honest person.
    (I may have a different opinion as i keep going.)

    Every one of us is a powerful mind with the ability to create our own reality, no one can create it for us, no event tells one exactly how to perceive what one lives, sees, touches, hears, smells and tastes.
    Parents are perceived differently by all their children, the life in a 3rd world country village is perceived differently by all, being blind, rich, short, fat, handicap, gifted, albinos, hungry, busy, calm is perceived differently by every one.
    But there are 2 ways to see life, mainly positive or mainly negative. That is a choice we make from our perception not from the world itself.
    I will get back to the doc....and tell more later...but first i got to go to work. See ya, later tonight!
    az

  • dewflirt

    Or just trust your judgement and duck out when your ready :)

  • Earthwinger

    Fair play to the doc for one thing though. it makes for a great straight man to poke fun at. ;)

    I just looked online, and one site claimed that Gamble spent about $8 million on this hogwash! Methinks, if he were really so concerned about the looming energy crisis, his money would have been much better spent if he'd donated it to one of the big fusion reactor projects.

  • PaulGloor

    Incredibly long winded production about conspiracy, free energy, ancient aliens and the human condition laced with pseudoscience.

    On the plus side, helped me get some much needed sleep.

  • dewflirt

    I checked him out too, grandson of Gamble . Maybe he's trying to restore the family name. 8million, withdraw it in cash and heat a small town for the next ten years burning that :)

  • over the edge

    just a couple of observations/questions for anyone who buys this nonsense
    - if aliens are visiting why don't they visit us on mass or at least visit a bunch of professional news crews ?
    - if governments are willing to harass/kill the creators of these technologies why not do the same to those who made this film
    - if these free energy machines exist why doesn't this guy fund the production of new machines and give them away? if the government takes them make more.
    - why do aliens always have two arms.legs.eyes.walk upright.a face and share a very similar "construction" as us? our shape and mode of movement is rare on earth why would aliens have this same mode of movement?
    - finally why do these films have the same MO. they use conjecture,surround their conjecture/lies with real facts and hope that nobody notices? rely heavily on "eyewitness " accounts but are light on physical/independently confirmed facts? why ? because that's all they have. believe whatever you wish but real science and rational people are actually trying to make things better. please don't corrupt their hard work and twist it to fit some fantasy. the struggle for answers is too important to be distracted by this garbage. every second that they use divorcing themselves from these Charlestons, keeping their ideas from being corrupted and trying to correct the misinformation of these nut jobs is time better spent finding real answers

  • Dovidw

    As long as the dominant message for the salvation of humanity is defined in terms of the redistribution of wealth, the world is doomed to self destruct. The only solution is to recreate man as a spiritual being as in the dictum of the Vilna Goan "When you deny man his spirituality you deny him his humanity and render him a biped beast." Further, Eric Fromm stated in his 1958 interview with Mike Wallace "If America continues in the direction it is taking it is in serious danger of destroying itself..it has become production crazy and consumption crazy;" we have transformed means into ends.

  • dewflirt

    Aliens have to look like us, or rather we have to look like them. They are our gods remember, we're made in their image ;)

  • over the edge

    @dewflirt
    oh yeah sorry i forgot lol. friggin deadbeat gods

  • Achems_Razor

    Some people may find this doc to be the cats meow, the bees knees, the dogs dangle, but it ain't me babe.

    Holeymoley! Deepak, Haramein, Icke and gang?... but "Crop Circles" on the other hand?

  • RikG01

    What the ****...Seriously? Aliens? I suffered the bloated, overly-flashy, self-important intro to get to a load of ****-wipe about Aliens?

    Foster Gamble, I want my time back, you arrogant, egotistical, conspiracy-theory nut-bag. I can't believe you spent any time at all creating this puffed up excuse for corporate propaganda. "oh it's not the Big Corporations like Proctor and Gamble that are scr*wing you, honest guv".

    Twat.

  • leonardobdas

    silly hippies.

  • wh33tabix

    I'm very glad most people see this docu as garbage. I couldn't stand it when I watched it a few months ago.

    I'm all for change, but this film offers nothing tangible as a solution.

  • wald0

    A complete waste of time in my opinion, psuedo-science mixed with dooms day prophecy.

  • sunny51

    There sure are a lot of negats commenting here.
    I'm 20 minutes into it and find it very interesting.

  • mor4humanity

    This is the best assessment of what is going on that I have seen in a long time!

    Some of the comments here are terrible. Anti-critical thinking, fear of change fools...

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Matt-Kukowski/100001515201862 Matt Kukowski

    Fast forward to about 45:00 to get to the MEAT... the beginning is a totally different doc, IMHO. 45mins and on is what needs to be debated and talked about. See son? See? Hehe love internet peace and global health.

  • sunny51

    I'm only about 30 minutes into it and I find it very interesting. It seems like it would be good to see the early part for better understanding. I say go ahead and watch it all but each can take it or leave it any way he likes.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=596969340 Brandon Cooper

    good idea bad presentation...... of course some esotherik crap but the idea itself is nice ....

  • SmoTh

    It's fabulous. The text description of the video from the authors are spot on. One of those videos that every man and woman should take the time to see, and ponder on in which way the current governmental system effects our lives.

    Though, the start of this video is somewhat questionable to say the least, I must admit.

  • Teddy Mcd

    I must disagree with some comments and agree with others:-)..

    The first 45-50 mins was an okay review of much that we know. Particularly the Fed - not so much crop circles. The latter half he went full bore on the NWO conspiracy and he used Icke and Deepak as voices of - authority? I think not. I've come across these guys many times. Their technique of assembling facts which they dissemble later can best be called - bricolage, because they gather what they want from sundry sources (some facts and plenty of fiction) - mix and mash it together with a minimum desire for truth and maximum dreams of another book deal.

    Slick presentation tho - fx and graphics - cute.

  • Oxley

    Some interesting and factual points but if you're going to make a serious argument one would have to leave out crop circles and David Iyke and UFOs.

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/2K5JO3ZZEDAAIK7NOAUDZO7G54 mark

    heres a question why dont you go suck on some quarks ?

  • over the edge

    @mark
    thanks for showing all of us your level of intelligence

  • Guest

    This was great! Yes do watch it till the end!

  • Teddy Mcd

    @Oxley

    Methinks you may have glossed over my comment or perhaps I wasn't clear.

    1 - Crop circles - I did not mean to imply an exoteric explanation for their appearance. I really don't know. But the incredible detail and amazing complexity of say less than 5% - leaves me a'wondering.

    2 - I don't see where I mentioned UFOs. Perhaps you inferred such from the manner I left crop circles open to debate.

    3 - David Icke and Deepak Chopra - please note that I say, "he used Icke and Deepak as voices of - authority?" The key of course is the question ? mark following authority(?). I was ridiculing both of them because they have only pseudo-scientific credentials when holding forth on such matters.

    Hope this clears that up. I will try to write with more precision. I assure you. Cheers.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Charles-Alderson/100001294124792 Charles Alderson

    To be honest he used Icke and the other dude but what they said about like... when Icke talked about the fishing pole and the economy, he wasn't wrong. It wasn't their normal platform and they were somewhat held in check by the theme of the doc. Not everyone who is an id**t is always wrong. Like most docs, you have to come to it with an open mind, listen to everything it presents, and THEN make your decision on what was worthy of taking with you. In a way its like... I'm Atheist but I agree with nearly everything Jesus says. You don't throw away the whole doc because Icke was in it.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Charles-Alderson/100001294124792 Charles Alderson

    My comment is waiting for approval but I didn't say anything bad or post a link D; I don't understand.

    I give up. Do I need to use * or @ or + in every word that can be considered derogatory? Even if it's not aimed at anyone?

  • citalotus8

    Wow you only watched a few mins into this and have this much hostility? basically this is what i made of your rant-

    1. you dont believe there are aliens.

    2. new technology and science is kooki..

    3.Proctor Gamble is a fart smelling tortoise/Bush look alike

    First off im plainly calling you closed minded on number one dont sound smart on a subject you clearly haven't done your research in it by definition makes you ignorant. Second the movie is about free energy and how its being kept hostage and this exposes government corruption and conspiracies yadda yadda etc. this part you didnt even make it to because once again your close minded. And lastly the fart smelling tortoise part was hilarious good work on that

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Charles-Alderson/100001294124792 Charles Alderson

    dewflirt and I might be best friend soul mates. He/She likes everything I post AND understood my Bleach reference! Big brownie points for knowing Bleach!! My all time favorite show/story in the history of mankind (and I've read almost all of them)!

  • dewflirt

    Morning Charles, have to admit I (a girl) only know it by accident, my brother watches it online when he comes to stay with us. That and fullmetal alchemist (?), I prefer the studio ghibli films myself. They're just so beautiful :)

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Charles-Alderson/100001294124792 Charles Alderson

    Dewflirt I Don't want to get into who we are openly here! Add me on facebook and see if you actually share similar interest. Studio Ghibli flims take up all of my hard drive ;( I recently transferred them all to my Zune. Anime and this website seem to be my life. Topdocs is actually my homepage. So much to learn from these docs and even from those anime we watch. The stories are beautiful indeed, and all have an invigorating message within them. I can't help it... I love Asian culture!

  • dewflirt

    Sorry Charles, don't do Facebook or anything like it. Minor act of rebellion, though probably pointless. I get some flack for it, apparently it's as bad as not having a phone but then I don't answer that either unless I feel like it :)
    And to keep us on topic, did you manage to watch the whole film? Can't help but feel it's somehow linked to the Venus Project, has that same air of plastic reality about it, nice and fake.

  • dewflirt

    I get a bit muddled on that, can say bloody and bugger but not P@ssy cat or i*iot. Easier to star everything :)

  • dewflirt

    Nothing remotely ignorant or closed minded about earthwinger, very delicious person indeed :)

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Charles-Alderson/100001294124792 Charles Alderson

    Yes I did watch the entire film. As I've watched nearly every doc on this site, I'm fully aware of all these conspiracy theories and the people he had on the show are etc etc. The one thing I do believe in is the very end. We are all interconnected and would do so much better to cooperate instead of compete. I can't help but feel like if I could be president for 1 term I could fix all of this. It's rather easy to do, you just have to overcome your greed and want of ultimate power over people.

    Soon we will be at war with Iran, and again another religious war when honestly I think religion has ran its course as soon as our father's generation dies off. You saw in the last doc "In god we trust" just how (can't use derogatory words) but i mean... religion seems to make your brain not work properly. I feel that there is a sort of spiritualism in our lives, but it's not in any revised, re-translated, inaccurate text from 4000bc. I believe that just the common bond we have with each other is enough to replace an ancient code of laws. I consider myself a somewhat violent person and I own guns and wouldn't hesitate to take someone's life in defense of my family or my neighbors but for complete nonsense like the wars we have now, I just couldn't do it.

    I'm beginning to ramble but you get what I'm saying. 1 love man. We're all here on this earth for a very short time so just make the best of it and enjoy your trip. Introspection is the best way to solve outer problems. Disarm yourself first to show you stand for peace and Iran wouldn't care so much to kill Americans etc.

  • Earthwinger

    Heya citalotus :)

    I don't think I was being overly hostile, just having a bit of a laugh with it, as honestly, that's all I think it's fit for. I wouldn't call myself closed minded either. I'm fascinated by the sciences, and new technologies, but all that talk about free energy? Who knows, maybe one day we might be able to tap into hitherto unknown energy sources, but if credible scientists around the world, thought for one minute that it was even remotely possible to achieve that now, we'd be seeing a lot of serious research on the subject. In the meantime, I'll pin my hopes on good science like nuclear fusion, that in principle, we know will work, once the technical hurdles have been overcome.

    Re. your points :-

    1. Given the size of the universe, I think it's quite likely that life exists elsewhere, but do I believe that benevolent aliens are trying to contact us? Simply put, no....and that's a position that I'll maintain until someone provides me with REAL evidence to the contrary. I'm sorry but anecdotes don't impress me one bit.
    2. See my opening paragraph. The trick is, IMO, to differentiate between good science and quackery.
    3. Yeah, you got me bang to rights on that one! :)

    Feel free to call me closed minded if you wish, but for what it's worth I'll say again, I have a keen interest in the sciences, and I'm open to a wide spectrum of possibilities, but only in so far as they stand up rigorous scrutiny. This film fails at the first hurdle IMO, when they present claims from snake oil salesmen like Nassim Haramein, and try to pass it off as good science...it's just not!

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Charles-Alderson/100001294124792 Charles Alderson

    And I rather like the idea of the Venus Project. It would just take an entire shift of everything we do in our lives now to make it work. It would be very hard but very worth it.

  • dewflirt

    I'm always very ambivalent about 'spirituality'. I was raised in a commune by hippy parents and subjected to Guru Maharaji and boring brown food. Even as a kid the Divine Light Mission used to worry me, any man that thinks I should kiss his feet is not a man preaching love and equality. Everyone has a conscience, if they used it rather than ignore it in favour of personal gain then we would all rub along quite nicely. Only one thing that matters, do as you would be done by. Think that has been covered by pretty much every religious/spiritual group going. Everything else is unnecessary, overkill. President for one term sounds good, hope you take it more seriously than our PM, for him it's just a day job, he said as much. Would you have anime taught in schools? :)

  • dewflirt

    If people made it to the point that something like the Venus Project became possible, we would no longer need something like the Venus Project! ;)

  • Earthwinger

    I had some hippy friends way back, who followed Guru Maharaji. Every time something good happened to them it was put down to “Maharaji magic.” One time, my friend hopped out of the back of his van and said he'd been in need of some new shoes, and lo and behold he'd found a pair of trainers....proof positive of “Maharaji magic.” He was pretty gutted when I said they were mine, and that I'd lost them the last time we'd had a day out together. :)

    I don't think their kids bought into it either. They were forever giving their parents withering looks. :D

  • dewflirt

    Poor kids, but at least they'll be able to spot a cult when it rears it ugly head and when that ugly head passes its hat round at the end they'll be smart enough to leave it hungry. Maharaji has made a very good living from donations. You don't have to give much, just as much as you can. That's Maharaji Magic ;)

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Charles-Alderson/100001294124792 Charles Alderson

    In the arts yes. There are some really amazing anime's that do things very similar to what this site does, make you think. They are the same as classics just in cartoon form. Bleach > Homer's Illiad and Oddesy

  • dewflirt

    Maybe throw in a few Discworld books as well? Have you checked out KeenTalks yet? I love it over there, so shiny and new its like walking on fresh snow. Love the talks, they have to tell you more because they can't let the film speak for them. So much more info in them :)

  • mick paw

    this doc. is poor of quality
    it has a little to do with a real science
    it's more like a tabloid :)

  • mick paw

    especially gto :)

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Charles-Alderson/100001294124792 Charles Alderson

    Yes! I've been on Keen daily since it was posted. I'm not sure they can keep up with me though. I go through these things very fast and they need like 3-5 new lectures a day to keep up. I have way too much time on my hands. At least I'm doing something productive with it all though. Learning things is like all I live for. I dunno how I retain all this stuff but I swear I could win a gameshow or something from everything I've seen in the past 7 years I've been self employed.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Charles-Alderson/100001294124792 Charles Alderson

    For those of you who stopped watching because of who's in it, I suggest you wait for my post to be approved from earlier or just finish watching it. It's not as bad as you might think from the people who make cameos.

    @ Earthwinger The alien stuff stops early. Just make it to the end and he does actually make some sense. Just gotta absorb the entire video, and then make your judgements on what's decent and what isn't.

    I would love if the alien thing were true. I'm reading Gilgamesh right now and it seems like things were so cool in that story. You can't deny that those ancient alien people at least have a small leg to stand on. They do provide some evidence for their theory that does make more sense than commonly accepted Egyptology does. Graham Hancock and Robert Bauval also have a very interesting theory with again, a bit of evidence to support it (lost civ). At the very least they have more evidence than Abraham does.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_ES5YFURR5VOTKTGHD4PIVYXPVI John

    I agree with Charles A. that there's actually some valuable information in this documentary, especially in the second half. Though I don't quite buy the alien stuff and think the video would be much more useful without it. The evidence presented for the alien perspective could be interpreted different ways. While I suppose, if we want to be open minded, we should at least accept the possibility of an alien history, I don't think this film demonstrates any concrete evidence for it. If you can get past the brief segment of ET stuff and focus on the content of the documentary as a whole I think you will find it worth watching.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Charles-Alderson/100001294124792 Charles Alderson

    Thanks Vlatko. I'll put *'s in words like that from now on. Having a hard time checking my vocabulary because normally I just say whatever I please. I'll put more thought into my posts from now on.

  • Guest

    About the alien stuff...Why are UFO such a crazy idea when humans themself aspire to become UFO to other planets, and that only on the last 100yrs or so?

    Everything we see is the assembly of millions of particles. When i look at a person, i see the perceived assembly, i don't see the spaces between the particles even though i know there is more space then there are particles.
    Perhaps when humans look at the energetic field of a UFO event, they perceive it as being an object, they perceived UFO as having eyes and arms such as humans, but the perception is in the mind of the perceiver. May be UFO are not made of particles but just energy. Would my perception based on the only reality i know, create an assemblage that fits my reality?

    Science is willing to tell us that there may be 11 dimensions but as soon as someone mentions a second reality, he become a lunatic...i don't know, i prefer to stay open to all possibilities.
    I don't say there is, i don't say there isn't, i just wait until it's my turn to make up my mind.

    On to the rest of the doc.
    az

  • allanjohn1961

    thank you for showing this documentary. I will get as many people as i can to watch this documentary. I have now seen on film what i have always believe in. yes the people of Earth can make this real. yes it will happen in time,but we all need to work together.

  • Achems_Razor

    @Charles Alderson:

    I have moderated your post in question, Your posts are good, our moderation system is the one that does not like certain words, but no problem, practice makes perfect, even @dewflirt is catching on. lol

  • Guest

    About Crop Circles.... Let's face it, the intricacy of the patterns are extremely complex to the point where this is no way a few people with hand tools can create such a result overnight or even over a couple of days on the ground without being seen.
    Could it be that a laser type of reflector apparatus could follow a set pattern while being flown by an airplane. A tool invented by science for the army or space program? But then why use it in wheat fields? Why complex geometry? Is it the work of a few artists, why keep it secret?
    Puzzling....that's all....and until the answer is found....people will talk about it as a mystery from an other dimension because it does not fit this one.
    az

  • Guest

    The Torus....it's about time this shape gets the attention it deserves.

    Free energy...of all the things that can change the physical world...no other one has the potential to be more powerful than free energy. Bring it on and the whole financial system collapses overnight. Who would want that? Why is it not happening? Why is it not researched?
    It is researched just not subsudized by those attached to the monetary system and since the monetary system pays for research...

    Follow the money....how many docs on the making of money does the world need in order to say...enough! We are scared to loose it all, scared shiteless to become money less.
    az

  • Guest

    Health....darn!, like all good things gone bad. Follow the pharmaceutical company motive's...very very simple. I know i lived for 7 yrs with a man who was director of operation for Pharmaco Austin TX while living in Austin, Belgium and California. It opened my perception to that world.

    MONEY not health is a large percentage of their interest.
    az

  • Guest

    If you don't like the doc so far, start at approx 1:10 and re-read your comment.
    az

  • Guest

    What David Hicke says around 1:15 has nothing to do with crazyness other their the crazyness we allow ourself to live.
    We are told that China or Korea are controlled. This is done is order to blind us to what kind of control we are submitted to.
    az

  • dewflirt

    Checked this film through the new millionshort search engine, seems a lot of the people in this film are making it known that had they understood what it was about, or been allowed to see it before its release, they would not have appeared in it. Even Deepak Chopra is regretting it. Sorry, can't tell you where I found this stuff as my history is off. Trust me, I'm a rabbit :)

  • oompaul

    Imagine a sandwich with 300 slices of truth on top, and 300 slices of truth at the bottom, and in the centre, the Big Lie? Think anyone will notice?

  • Guest

    Global Domination...what else is there to say. Divide people and they got it made, people can police each other with the occasioaln help from the big boys (as we have seen at Toronto G20)

    I feel this man is putting his life on the line. He is even accusing his own family of being part of the scheme.

    Sorry for posting so many seperated comments, but i am chewing it a bit at the time.
    az

  • Guest

    Solutions:
    Many good solutions are being suggested here so i don't need to repeat them.

    One of our solution on TDF would be...let's quit arguing about religion on TDF, especially coming from our top participants. Please let's offer positive eloquence, that is the only way to change people's opinion. We cannot hope to end religion control by arguing one on one for days, but we can influence many by being articulate about the power of self energy, that is what we are Godly if not GOD.
    Let's make TDF "one of" the best world tool to inform people on what can be done to better the world and take our freedom back by showing that we will not allow war on small scale, no more than war on big scale.

    Have a nice day everyone. The sun is shining and my day is about to explode with joy with my grand son at the beach, buckets and shovels in hands.
    az

  • CapnCanard

    Azilda, I am with you on the whole crop circle thing... I still believe they are likely to be man made, however, whoever is doing it is really gifted. It would be nice to see someone step up and offer some reward to whomever could create a circle that is as complex as the most complex circles found. Make duplicates, should be even easier the second time. Let them do in the day light for all to watch and give them much of the day to complete it. Just as a demonstration. If no one steps forward then you have answer. If someone steps forward to claim responsibility and can actually do the circles very close the original image, then you have an answer. If not, then we are left with a mystery. I predict people would step forward but it is not clear that anyone would make circles good enough.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_ELGOPCC3LBVWXVJ3JYIHBVY54A Revilo

    I hold Topdocumentaryfilms com in very high esteem.

    That being said, in my humble opinion, it is sensationalistic garbage like this film, that is intrinsically destructive to the advancement of society.

    Less space alien v.s government agency brainial implant conspiracy doc's, and more cutting edge science & sociological doc's please...

    Thx
    ~Oliver

  • PavolvsBitch

    when i was a child, my favourite toy was a set of 'spiro gyro' discs, compasses etc. as i studied and even visited some crop circles as part of my 'new age' adventures, it hadn't occured to me how simple it would be to train a lazer through a template to reproduce the effects. And that, to me, makes perfect sense. The symbols are not for our benefit. They warn and re-impress truths from the past.

  • PavolvsBitch

    ah, for even so much truth .... of course, the lie would be identified! That's what truth does, identify patterns and those falling outside a template of truth would be found to be lies.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_ZMK6YNWJACHQ5CRCJW5TNYFURI KsDevil

    Like a toroid, this documentary appears to contain some interesting information that is surrounded by a field of self promotion. Still, I don't think I will create more debt by sending this orginization money that I will have to work harder for in order to pay it back to the world economic system. After all knowledge should be freely exchanged, not comoditized, right?

  • PavolvsBitch

    Yes, it has been 'outted'. All of these documentaries have been 'authorised' and funded through the labyrinth of ngo's doing the will of The UN. The trick is to encourage us all to see the necessity of an universal credit/debit system based on carbon use. Also, the ideas of 'overpopulation' and 'shortage of resources' are entirely fallacious in reality; just controlled by the same merchants now as ever.

  • dewflirt

    The longer I spend here the less I trust what I see, always checking things out and then checking my checks. Different with individual people, I tend to take people at face value. This film is now in the hands of the NWO conspiracy theorists, I think that's going a bit far to be honest, just full of silliness would do. I don't like the film, I don't want to waste time proving myself right. Happy to be biased on this one ;)

  • Pysmythe

    Quite large stencils/templates, perhaps? And designed in such a way that, by overlapping in various ways, the patterns can be changed? And made out of a material light enough to be easily transported? My understanding is that the crops don't need to be pressed completely flat in order for the pattern to be sharply outlined from the air. Something like this, maybe, in combination with the "rope and board" technique already demonstrated, might work as an explanation?

    It's a beautiful conundrum, for sure. I agree that the whole phenomenon is man-made, obviously... And I also believe it is, quite literally, global satire without the words, a way of showing how credulous people can be. The artists (the culprits!) create an apparently impossible work, and then sit back in satisfaction as the supernatural and extraterrestrial explanations roll in.

  • dewflirt

    If you get the centre right and use templates from there, working outwards, it might be easier than it looks. Even for some of the really complicated ones you'd only need a few shapes or spacers..... And a parachute. Easy ! :) just a thought, you don't often get to see the rubbish ones, the ones that look like a bunch of kids have trashed the field. These guys could be out practising all the time for all we know :)

  • dewflirt

    I know from doing patchwork that the bigger the pieces the more forgiving they are, no matter how complicated the pattern. You can always manipulate things a bit to make them fit. From a distance things look clearer and more precise. If you get close to a crop circle you can't see the whole thing and all its inaccuracies.

  • Pysmythe

    A bunch of bored, disillusioned draftsmen, who had childhood aspirations for hanging at the Louvre! The catch being, they're all about 1 inch tall and bright blue, the eldest sporting a nicely cropped grey beard.

    (I read all 91 stanzas, slowly. Tough read, but I enjoyed it. The rhythm seemed syncopated, like jazz. I tried to follow my old English professor's advice and let the stresses fall naturally, but I kept getting thrown off the horse!)

    edit- Of course, I wasn't exactly expecting a limerick, lol.

  • Hodd

    How do they heat and bend all of the plant stems without breaking them while they are making their crop circle?

  • dewflirt

    Are we talking smurfs here? All 91, That's what I like, a man that gets stuck in ;) you didn't fancy the more popular, shorter version then?

  • dewflirt

    Don't know, haven't made that bit up yet ;)

  • Earthwinger

    flirty, re. your earlier post, I just found this ....

    In a just-released statement, Robbins, Chopra, Hawken, Sahtouris, Elgin, Shiva and Mitchell write that they have “grave disagreements” with some parts of the film.

    “We are dismayed that our participation is being used to give credibility to ideas and agendas that we see as dangerously misguided. We stand by what each of us said when we were interviewed. But we have grave disagreements with some of the film’s content and feel the need to make this public statement to avoid the appearance that our presence in the film constitutes any kind of endorsement.”

  • Pysmythe

    A video I saw about them showed the crops barely pressed down at all, viewed from eye-level, but from the air they're sharp as razors. I guess these things aren't as hard to make as some think?

  • Hodd

    Nothing yet known to man can duplicate genuine crop circles. Am I right in my assumption that you haven't even looked at the phenomena and what's been discovered?

  • Pysmythe

    Smurfs, yeah. And why not? They're already on this planet, so they're a better explanation, no?

    I didn't want to let you down by half-as*ing it, but, yeah, first I read the shorter version and the wiki article with it. After that, I went for the full monty. :)

  • dewflirt

    That sounds very much the same as the one I read, must be pretty embarrassing for them. Would be interesting to see the uncut interviews, how far out of context their words were taken. I suspect not far for a few of them :)

  • dewflirt

    Smurfs it is then, mystery solved. This is like shelling peas, pass me another! You wouldn't have let me down, it's not exactly pretty is it? You can rest now ok, put some music on ;)

  • Pysmythe

    Not entirely right. I've looked at it SOME, but haven't obsessed about it. I hold with Occam's Razor as a matter of course: If human beings are capable of doing it, then that they are, in fact, doing it certainly works as the better explanation. And I've seen nothing to suggest otherwise, although I'm open to suggestions. But what's more impressive, a microprocessor or a crop circle? People can be pretty ingenious, you know!

    What do you think they are?

  • Pysmythe

    Noooo, it isn't...
    Downright brutal, in fact.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Charles-Alderson/100001294124792 Charles Alderson

    Smurfs really makes sense. Lets go with that.

  • Guest

    I am sure no credible person wants to be associated with the suppose confirmation of aliens and the mystery of crop circles.
    As for the rest of the doc.....a lot of good ideas still.
    az

  • Guest

    and what do you think of the doc?
    az

  • toddy

    Enjoyed the doc enough to watch it and keep me occupied for awhile. You know what the ending 30 or so mintues seems more like an infomerical.

  • mor4humanity

    Sociology is not a science... at all.

    It is 'created,' based on our 'created' social/economical/cultural system.

    Sociology would be completely different if we lived in another system, such a resource economy. Physics is physics in all systems, so is biology, math...etc

    Sociology makes me want to throw up, because it shows so openly the nonsense of the system we live in.

  • Pysmythe

    God, I don't even know where to begin with this doc.
    Did I enjoy it?
    Yes.
    Is it profoundly DEPRESSING in many ways?
    Absolutely, yes.
    Do I trust everything I see on the Internet?
    Uh, no.
    Do I think we should park a bullet in the system as it stands now (the Fed, fractional-reserve banking, et al.)?
    You better believe it.
    So do I subscribe to a centuries-long conspiracy of "lizard people" (which wasn't specifically mentioned herein, but never mind) looking to enslave us?
    Don't be insane.
    Do I believe, on the other hand, that the upper-classes think they're entitled to rule over the rest of us "for our own good," because "they're smarter"?
    Sonny boy, you can BANK on it.

    It's hard, to say the least, to know what to make of this world, as it always was, I'm sure. I will say that I have a strong fear that we're going to end up setting ourselves way, way back before our lessons are really learned. But I will also say that the greater part of this doc seemed to me like all of the worst parts of the Book of Revelation, in the style in which some of those ideas have become ingrained lately in the Western world, the economic and political horrors, rfid chips, one-world government, etc., etc., and I wonder how much of an influence such paranoia may have had here, how much is a carry-over from what are always very popular fears, but dressed up new to be more suitable for the world as it is now.

    About torus energy, I have very grave doubts... From this doc, I get the idea it's supposed to be "free," and, I'm sorry, but nature simply doesn't allow for such a thing, and nothing specific is ever said about precisely how it's supposed to work, anyway. And the fact of a few universal geometric figures doesn't signify a d*mned thing, other than a tendency for civilizations to scribble in similar ways. And why would an advanced species go to the trouble of making a pattern in a field of crops so similar to what was tacked onto the fenders of the Voyager spacecraft, as opposed to simply parking their flying saucer in the dealership parking-lot? Does anyone REALLY believe it's because it could've originated from some other "dimension"? And the signature face next to it looked suspiciously like Fox Mulder!

    All in all, quite an interesting documentary, which I recommend, with a lot of great ideas towards the end, but I do think we need to be very careful to separate the wheat from the chaff.

    edit- When I wrote the above, apparently I wasn't clear on precisely what he meant by the torus, from what had come earlier, as I hadn't finished watching the last 15 minutes of it... which just goes to show you, doesn't it? But I gotta tell ya, it sounds suspiciously like a religion to me, and those have only ever been about controlling people.

  • Guest

    We trust science? We trust that everything is proven with math? What would be so weird if everything was recognized in sacred geometry? Isn't geometry visual math?
    az

  • Pysmythe

    Yes, it is. But it's not that that concerns me. It's just the idea that maybe it's being given more weight than is really justified. Nothing is said of the multitude of other geometric patterns that are found in, say, Egypt, that are NOT found in China or Central America. Why is that? Don't they count, too?

    It seems a little too selective in THIS doc. Confirmation bias, in other words.

    edit- And I think he is probably ascribing a meaning to the original scribblers that they could not possibly have intended... And to then say AFTERWARDS that, "Oh, THIS is what it REALLY signifies" does not seem wise.

  • http://www.facebook.com/cchristiankg Christian Klinckwort Guerrero

    Thank you, wow. Myself was fortunated enough to live in the "Cuevas de Buracas" ,Canary Islands, from 1978 till 1983. five years, I called it "in the lap of God". Today in mexico City, surviving. How can I help?

  • ArTilleRY118

    What on earth. Research some of the people they interview, do some proper research, most of them are ******* nuts! God I wish this stuff was true but i'm not risking my sanity for the sake of living in a sci-fi story. If this gets real scientific acceptance fine, but until then I'm staying skeptical. Call me a cynic but Religion especially has tarnished my view of human intelligence, and we're all brilliant story tellers, finding meaning in life even though there probably isn't any. Keep the story a story though, when you embrace it you could just be embracing madness.

    What the ****, I'm high as ****, how the hell did I even come across this video.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_ZJRXQ6RHS5QPRP3QX5HZDKRZLE Jeremy

    I found this a while back, not sure if it has anything to do with anything, but... It seemed interesting, seemed to roll right in with QM, and it made pretty good sense in my head. is @ Youtube

    /watch?v=4Bb627wkjmQ

    3 parts, watch em all for full effect. If anyone knows about this guy I'd love to hear it, was not able to find much at all about him on google, but, if this doc is even slightly true, ya... we know where he is.

    oh, ya this is relating to the free energy idea, not sure if it is anything worthwhile like I said.

  • citalotus8

    Earthwinger- I agree on most of your points, the movie is kinda like the secret in it is very hopeful but doesn't point the way very clearly...Science in the movie is mostly fantasy when you compare it to the conventional science of today but your forgetting science is bought and paid for by people who use it as they will and free energy is not on their agenda and why should it the people in control of it live like kings collecting our monthly electric bill. But the science is real has been for years and this movie helps shed light on our corrupt world and it also talks about aliens which have been here since the stone age sister.

  • http://www.facebook.com/ElmoPutz David Foster

    Heh... Here we go with the "Free Energy" again!

    Talk about not understanding your basic sciences!

  • Pysmythe

    Some funny cynicism in this post. Made me laugh full bore for about 90 secs -such images, lol.
    And I needed it, too.
    Thanks.

  • mor4humanity

    So I suppose that the fact that Einsteins Theory of relativity falls apart these days, does not show you that even hard science can change with new additions to knowledge?

    I can make free energy right here and now with a basic water hose and generator with a propeller on it??? Its basic, but it makes electricity, and denies historically accepted physics... So now what with your lack of reasoning skills...

  • Guest

    You could suggest these to Vlatko for the Keen Talks.
    Copy the first link of Artificial Gravity/Cosmic Matrix and then send it through CONTACT above.
    az

  • Earthwinger

    "I can make free energy right here and now with a basic water hose and generator with a propeller on it??? Its basic, but it makes electricity, and denies historically accepted physics"

    Nah it doesn't. You're putting energy into the system, in the form of pressurized water. :)

  • joe soap

    Discription is misleading, i came here looking to follow the money and ended up watching new age, masonic, ancient alien nonsense.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_ELGOPCC3LBVWXVJ3JYIHBVY54A Revilo

    I stand corrected.

    I was mearly trying to intend that, topdocumentaryfilms com should propagate less deludid ideals.

    Leave the conspiracy propagation to youtube com

    ~Oliver

  • Earthwinger

    Ooh, here's an interesting point that I forgot to mention earlier, when I was talking about fusion reactors....the Tokamak type fusion reactor, is a torus shaped design. So I'll happily concede that it's a very groovy and spiffy shape, just not in a new age, cosmic vibration kinda way. ;)

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_ZJRXQ6RHS5QPRP3QX5HZDKRZLE Jeremy

    IMO, other than the David Icke nonsense, (and to be open and honest, the ancient alien idea is equally r*tarded and possible at the same time) however with no evidence, it's much easier to side with the non alien view point. That said, Most of the trail of money in this film is accurate. If you are looking for the source of problems, watch this film. Ignore the "theoretical" stuff if it's not your bag, the rest is good information. I actually enjoyed this documentary, got nervous when the ancient aliens stuff came up, but I managed to push it aside, with a grain of salt, and plow through it. I hardly see religion as being a driving force in the evolution of society, which seemed to be something he was pushing. Other than that, the money facts are there.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Rick-Kiriakidis/622989020 Rick Kiriakidis

    This was a mediocre science fiction movie.

  • misterkel

    Umm - have you seen the section here titled -Conspiracy?

  • misterkel

    To all those who scoff at the idea of free energy in this film - the vacuum energy is a well accepted scientific principle based on General Relativity and Quantum Electro-Dynamics, possibly the most successful scientific theory ever.

    I don't personally believe in vacuum energy, but modern science actually does - it's not a fringe idea at all. The only problem is that it may be impossible to retrieve. So, when you scoff, you're actually scoffing at the mechanism posited as fundamental to the Big Bang. If you actually believe in modern science, then you should believe in this idea. Of course, he actually argues that energy stored in the electro-magnetic field of the earth can be used. And that energy is there. Nikola Tesla thought he could send electricity all over the planet without wires. And he was a pretty accomplished scientist.

  • misterkel

    The principle he's talking about does not deny physics at all - he's saying the energy is already there in the Earth's magnetic field - and of course it is. The idea is to utilize that energy, not to magically create it from nothing.

  • Jason Schafer

    Though I think the first 1/5 of the film is right on but would turn many people off from watching the rest of it, (I get it) Very well done film in whole. It is as if they watched a few years of Alex Jones, others, and consolidated it to something coherent and interesting.

    All in all, I see some light as these (Gamble's) family of the P&G (Gamble part) that see and believe in the unveiling. I only wish others saw the same light and this film.

  • Jason Schafer

    Tesla did make it happen. He died a broken man with many arrows in his back as many innovative people have gone before.

  • Jason Schafer

    Once in the day one professor said he worked on the lunar rover, another said he worked on being able to determine when earthquakes would happen, another said he made holographic imagery back before it was known, another worked on a periphery of NASA and said there are sinister spirits they sent him and wanted nothing to do with them again.

    He worked on the lunar rover I found out, the other lied and created earthquakes (worked there), in between I worked with Barco (Elbilcon) and we saw what we imagined and designed, but the guy that said he heard sinister spirits.... I never worked with as he was killed.

    Tesla was real and Edison a sinister.

  • Jason Schafer

    HAARP don't laugh at it as that was Tesla's deal. Visit Alaska South East of Fairbanks. When I was there they called it a weather machine. Now that part is funny but true too.

  • http://www.facebook.com/Robert.C.Dinsmore.III Rob Dinsmore

    This falls into the category "So bad that it is good" I am laughing my ass off.

  • Guest

    @Achems....is that right, all edit will have to go to moderators now?
    hum....i edit just about every one of my comments.
    az

  • http://www.facebook.com/seanwaldo Sean Waldo Knight

    why is this tagged conspiracy? this is theroy physics that just have not been proven to be wrong

  • ThisDarkChestOfWonders

    Lets consider(pretend, w/e) there are E.T.s all over the cosmos. All of them existing in different evolutionary timescales and becoming sentient at different instances in time. Now the question of why we havent had open contact would be answered very simply. They are waiting for us as a single species(consciousness) to decide whether or not to peacefully coexist and prosper with the gifts we have been given. I come to the conclusion, based on the way we treat ourselves and all of nature, that we are doomed. T_T If we can't stop those in power from leading us on this current path of destruction we will either destroy ourselves or put our species back millenia at least. So sad. So sorry.

  • Earthwinger

    Erm.....no. He said that using compressed water, he could spin up a prop, attached to a motor which would generate electricity. He then claimed that somehow, that defied the laws of physics. I was the one that said no it didn't. :)

  • Earthwinger

    “To all those who scoff at the idea of free energy in this film - the vacuum energy is a well accepted scientific principle based on General Relativity and Quantum Electro-Dynamics, possibly the most successful scientific theory ever.”

    You're missing the point. This film is selling concepts as though they're real life solutions to problems that we face in the here and now. It may be that in the future it's possible to tap into energy sources currently unavailable to us (which I said earlier), but until they can demonstrate a working model, they're just cluttering up important debates, with noise.

    The energy crisis is real and it's happening now. Year on year, oil production is falling and demand is rising. Energy prices are increasing, and our governments are no doubt going to instigate more and bloodier wars as they fight over the remaining resources. So given the state of affairs, and urgency of the situation, one would think that if someone like Mr Gamble were prepared to throw $8 million at a film claiming to have the solutions to the worlds woes, then he'd also be able to afford to construct a working model of his torus device, to back up his claims. You and I both know why he hasn't though. ;)

    So it leaves me asking the question, why waste $8 million on a film like this? I suspect I know the answer though. The real message is at the end of the film, when he lays out his manifesto about little or no taxes, and shrinking back the government's role to protect individual liberty. The rest of the film is just smoke and mirrors. It's a feel-good movie, designed to placate people who might otherwise get a bit antsy (and rightly so) by offering them the possibility of a bright shiny future, whilst at the same time steering their thinking towards libertarian politics.

    Teabagger, sci-fi propaganda, a new low in documentary film making! :D

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Rick-Kiriakidis/622989020 Rick Kiriakidis

    Its theory backed by no science, basically I can make up my own theories and claim they are unproven within the context of physics.

    This entire documentary is based on things that are pure speculation if not fiction, anyone can claim anything but that doesn't make them fact. I believe in extra-terrestrial life, but I have no proof of it so I cant say with certainty that they exist, just like the torus exists, but its a far leap to say it has potential use in such things as free energy when it has not been proven yet!

  • Achems_Razor

    Az...Everything goes through the moderation system, so if you edit and put in unacceptable words or add links, will be moderated. Otherwise I believe edit should be no problem.

  • Pysmythe

    I will do that, thanks.
    (Avatar's a wood carving of a Legong Keraton dancer.)

  • Guest

    "The speed of our technological and scientific development has become unimaginably fast. Society cannot catch up with this speed and the philosophical interpretations of humanity’s major scientific achievements are dramatically lagging behind. So it is more than evident that our evolution, in terms of scientific and technological achievements, is developing faster than we can imagine."

    It takes years perhaps for a machine to be conceptualized, made, and marketed. When we talk about a machine that could replace oil production, dams, expensive solar panel and the rest....how carefull would a group have to be before it decides to make it fully known. I would suspect bits would leak in order to prepare for an unveiling. It has been this way for any world changing invention.
    For exemple, Russia's is doing a lot of research on paranormal activities and the result is being kept secret for a reason. If they were to capture the essence of our mind power, the collapse of the monetary system, government system, and many other system in place would be shaken to the ground. If such research is advancing in a positive way as expected when pure spiritual energy is in question, it is quite necessary to keep it under cover, in quarantine so it doesn't get infected by negative energy which is rampant all over the world.

    I am not saying this IS a fact yet, no more than i am saying 11 dimensions exist for sure. I am saying it is no more crazy an idea than the next.
    az

  • kolo

    This documentary only disturbs me. To think our educational system, at its very base, has been unable to give individuals the ability to differentiate between science and pseudo-science is tantamount to offering human sacrifice on a bloody rock on some hilltop.

  • Guest

    In the history of science, often times pseudo-science is transformed into real science with time, as our educational system has proven.
    az

  • CANADAIAN

    Would a squid design make more sense to you? Natural selection dictated we are physically how we are. And a very good design at that. So logically natural selection would work the same on another planet. If the alien planet is that similar to earth, would it not make sense that the evolution of species would be in significant resemblance to those on our planet? It would start from the same amino acids earths life started from.

  • Pysmythe

    I read a pretty good sci-fi book years ago, by Alan Dean Foster, called The I Inside ( a title you might especially appreciate?). In it, a supercomputer called the Colligatarch governs nearly all of the world's affairs, arbitrating disputes economic and political, social, etc., right up to issuing crop and weather forecasts. From the high to the mundane, this almost supernatural machine administers the entire world, and has been programmed to be completely benevolent and unbiased, issuing its edicts like a silicon Pope solely for what is in the world's best interest. Its power is so great and its tentacles strewn so far throughout the world's systems, that it can even appear to be psychic or intuitive (almost like an especially strong web bot), not always fully knowing the reasons for its unfailingly accurate decisions. Life in this world is pretty near idyllic, and so what ends up happening by the end, of course? The Colligatarch decides that mankind has to give up its near-absolute rule for its own good.

    I suppose the point is that our technology, however advanced it may get to be, will only ever take us but so far. It's always going to be (and it MUST be) human nature that decides the outcome of this world.

    The next 50 years are going to be some of the most interesting we've ever seen, for good or ill: Super strong A.I., perhaps transhumanism... It'll be fascinating to see how it all starts to shake out, and what paths we CHOOSE to evolve down.

    ( just a little aside here, this whole thing, pertaining to your first paragraph... Sorry I didn't address the rest of your content. )

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Rick-Kiriakidis/622989020 Rick Kiriakidis

    Making assumptions is not science, its not even pseudo-science, its basically an opinion.

    Even theory is based on general principles, not to say that the theories in this movie aren't all plausible, but I can theoretically replace his "torus" suppositions with "triangles" and say things like, we find triangles in nature and in ancient cultures and in mathematical equations, but that doesnt mean a triangle is the answer to free energy or any other assumptions made in this movie.

  • kolo

    Please give me one example in history where pseudo-science became real science. Just need one.

    Edit: Make sure your definition of pseudo-science and real science are up to date.

  • Pysmythe

    I'll give you one I just looked up. Apparently, the neuroplasticity of the human brain was once considered silly pseudoscience, but is now accepted as clearly established science.

    Germ theory is another one. It seems many of those pursuing this theory were considered quacks.

    edit- Plate-tectonics appears to be another one considered as such for a long while.

  • WTC7

    Alchemy... turned into chemistry

  • CANADAIAN

    In regards to crop circles, I would like is an actual reason why ppl would go to the trouble. For myself, to spend the years and and time recruiting ppl to help me do this, and keep it all secret...just to confuse ppl? Sorry, I'm not getting off the couch for that. There must be a real motive. Its been going on so long thats its been handed down through generations. Why? Typically a hoax has a benefit to the perpetrator. Maybe the knights templar make them. If they do you come back to why. Wheres the potential benefit in this?

  • RikG01

    It's hilarious but I've noticed a very sad pattern. The people defending this sci-fi Cess-pitt of a movie have one thing in common. They're arguing in maybes, possiblys and could-bes. There's not a shred of scientific process either in the coments defending this mulch, or throughout the video. Thrive is entirely useless rubbish. End-of.

    And Crop circles? Really? Crop circles are a hoax. The people who made the first ones stepped forwards and admitted it. They've demonstrated the process of making them time and time again on video.

    I'm sorry, anyone who says that this film has any value is just as deluded as those who think crop circles are anything other than a hoax. FG may have spotted some things about the unfairness of the world that the rest of us have already been researching but adding them to a video about theoretical aliens does not a good or insightful documentary make.
    Think of it this way. If you had an invention that would change the world and you wanted to share it with someone, would you go to a field and draw geometric patterns with corn, or would you just tell them? Perhaps provide the schematics?

    This website is for documentaries, not half-baked, conspiracy theories which amount to wishful thinking and have as much evidence to support them as fairies. If you'd any sense, you wouldn't defend this carp, you'd realise it for what it is. Exactly as Earthwinger has pointed out.
    Right-wing rich people, reaching out to gullible "spiritual" people to try get them to agree with reforms that will see the rich get further tax breaks.

    Grow up.

  • Pysmythe

    My view is simply that, if people are capable of doing it, then that they are is a much better explanation than anything else. Of course, I don't actually know, or care, what their motivations might be. If it's to espouse sacred geometry or esoteric philosophies, etc., then perhaps we're simply spectators to the manifestations of a cult. Whatever the case, at this point I can't see there being any profit for the rest of us in the study of crop-circles other than an appreciation of the skill and conditions with and under which they are executed.

  • RikG01

    The benefit is a good laugh at the expense of people who believe aliens would spend their time flattening crops rather than learning to speak or write in English.

    People across the globe have learned how to understand the languages of other nations, for millenia. Why would this be so much more difficult for a technologically advanced race, capable of hanging around our planet apparently on a whim?

    Are you suggesting that they may be capable of interstellar travel but they can't decipher simple language?

    Occam's Razor, kid. The simplest explanation is often correct. What's the simplest explanation for crop circles, given that they've been proven repeatedly to be fake? The answer is that they are fake.

  • WTC7

    Nothing wrong with the analysis of the functioning and goals of the global financial elite here. Spot on and not the first documentary that speaks about it with ample evidence to support the dire prognosis of what's ahead of us.

    UFOs are a fact and for some of them there is no rational explanation which leaves the possibility of interstellar or inter dimensional entities open.

    Some of crop circles shown here are obviously hoaxes, quite distinct in their ridiculously unrefined structure compared with some really sophistcated ones. Agree absolutely that someone should film the hoaxers making one of the sophisticated patterns in one day. That would put an end to this.

  • Pysmythe

    I don't believe it would, because the variables are so many and so great, even starting from the same basic soup, and even if the planet was an exact duplicate of earth. Look at how the races of man have evolved differently on this planet alone. One carrot advantageously thrown into the recipe 2 billion years ago, and we've all got four arms instead of two.

    And one eyeball.

  • CANADAIAN

    Right here is why i rarely post anything. Rik isn't isn't here to discuss things like an adult. Such a narrow view. But riks right, and he wouldn't have it any other way.

  • dewflirt

    It feels a bit miserable knocking crop circles, even though it is only human beans that make them I'm glad they do. Very beautiful. Why do they do it? I don't know. Why do graffiti artists do what they do? Who cares? It makes the place look better, sprinkles a bit of magic into unlikely places, makes people wonder and chat and meet in fields. All good. It could be the step patterns left behind by extreme Morris dancing ;)

  • CANADAIAN

    To me what you describe isn't that far off of the human body. They could have 6 arms, but the key features would be the hands, the feet. If the planet was shrouded in a fog they may evolve with no eyes, but be able to see like a bat does. Or they do have one eye and see in a sort of infrared. But looking at all creatures on our planet, which ones, if they possessed a developed brain like people, have the physical body to build objects like humans do. from micro chips to spaceships.

  • WTC7

    Occam's Razor, er, yes, the most logically acceptable explanation is certainly that two drunks were getting out of the pub in the middle of the night in rural England, and creating perfect patterns in the fields in pitch dark, making more than 200 of them for fun in the course of some 10 years. Sure, I don't see anything than would compete with that explanation. In the end, we are rational people.

  • CANADAIAN

    Thats the beauty of it, you don't care, I do in the sense I would like to understand. But I love your idea, it may just be art! One of the most sensible replies I've seen in regards to the circles.

  • CANADAIAN

    8 million would get him nowhere in the venture to which you refer. Building his taurus. Makes me think of the Kony video. Give Gavin 8 million, would it accomplish what he wanted. Probably not. But inform the masses. Make ppl aware and informed, get them on your side and you have a better chance of reaching your goal. I'm not trying to start a Kony debate here, just saying there is merit to the strategy.

  • Guest

    It's amazing men only have one pen*s too.
    az

  • Pysmythe

    But notice I only said ONE "carrot". Over the course of eons, with each species adding their own advantages to the mix over and over, I'd be very surprised if, even under the same conditions otherwise, any of them evolved to more than very superficially resemble anything we're familiar with. And remember that little man in the circle looked very much as we do. I could be wrong, but I just don't see it having happened like this anywhere else. I think it was Sagan who once wondered if we would even be capable of recognizing extraterrestrial life if we saw it, but, then again, he didn't have the same conditions in mind that we do...And, in any case, out of all the life that must be out there, if any were capable of contacting us, what must the odds be that they would be so similar?

  • Pysmythe

    I don't think that extreme Morris dancing is any more sensible than smurfs!
    (lol)

  • Pysmythe

    I'm working hard on evolving "truck nuts".
    (Perhaps I should talk to Robert!)
    And come to think of it, isn't the pen*s basically just an over-sized and over-elaborated clitoris?

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Rick-Kiriakidis/622989020 Rick Kiriakidis

    On crop circles, show me a video of an alien ship making them...
    That's what I thought.

    Show me a video of humans making them...
    YOUTUBE SEARCH: Making crop circles.
    Bingo.

  • Achems_Razor

    @WTC7:

    Exactly the same thing I was just going to say, but with the caveat that they must have been time travellers as well, travelling all over the world and somehow been in more than one place at the same time, doing their things with the boards and stuff, well quantum mechanics can do that why not a couple of drunks Eh?

  • Achems_Razor

    Az...not me thank Zeus! but some men do have two!

  • http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/about/ Vlatko

    Crop Circles... eh

    Let see, an intelligent species that travel near speed of light, or know how to exploit wormholes, instead of invading our poor planet, or just getting in contact, they thought: Why don't we just make some circles in those crops, there's nothing much to do here anyway. And we're going to do that on a regular basis. Yay!

  • axhed

    no. pseudo-science is crushed by the scientific method.

  • Corinne Collier

    In reading the current comments I feel you all have missed the deeper point. Which is if we do not start paying attention to our own backyard we will not have one to play in.
    Doesn't really mater about the crop circles. You are using that as a diversion and missing the big picture. It's about how to take control back that has been eroding from us right before our eyes.
    A small group of companies or families are gaining control of all vital aspects of our lives. That should scare the .... out of you! This is called a monopoly...... used to be illegal.
    I think the crop circles are beautiful but I also don't care to debate their origin. By taking that you are missing the most important and truly the one important aspect of this film.
    If you think Hunger Games is only a movie........ let your life continue as it is..... If you never want to experience the scenes it portrayed stop this useless debate and start being proactive now.

  • Guest

    No matter who, what or how the crop circles are made, the interesting part is the designs they come into.
    May be a satellite will catch the culprit one day.
    az

  • Guest

    It's not alien, it's an akin with a motive. Still interesting and mysterious.
    az

  • Teddy Mcd

    Caveat mes amis - Vlatlko, Razor - and the known suspects -

    This site would not be - without doubt. That's why we hang-around - sans doute.

  • Teddy Mcd

    @axhed

    True and well said - yet we need pseudo-science otherwise how would we know science. Right?

    As Bob Dylan has yet to say, but I will - 'Sometimes you need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows."

  • Earthwinger

    “8 million would get him nowhere in the venture to which you refer”

    And yet, enthusiastic amateurs are capable of building small scale fusion reactors out of bits of salvage, and odds and ends purchased on ebay! Don't believe me? Check out the doc. “Fusioneer” on this site. A small working model, if it were possible, could probably be made for thousands, never mind millions . Gamble didn't build a working model of his torus machine, because it's not possible. It's a fantasy, nothing more.

  • RikG01

    Aww bless ya, look at you trying to think.

    Of course they didn't make 200 more across the globe. They showed how they did it on video, then other people copied the method.

    I just love how your "logic" works. To you, it's more likely that aliens made pretty pictures, than a bunch of hoaxers looking for a laugh, took the mickey out of a bunch of gullible people. Brilliant.

    @canadaian I'm perfectly capable of discussing like an adult. You're the one making Ad hominem's rather than showing where my opinion, and the facts, are wrong. Like WTC7 you have a fascinating logic. It's more likely that I'm narrow minded, than you're wrong about aliens. Aliens, visiting the earth and, rather than learning our languages - a simple task for even the youngest of children - they go and shape crops with laser beams or gravity devices.

    Oh yeah, why didn't I realise it before. Obviously you're right. The simplest explanation is clearly that Bower and Chorley lied to cover up a government conspiracy to hide hyper-intelligent life-forms from other worlds, who could only communicate by flattening wheat.

    It's so obvious to me now, praise the martians! They've come to teach us how to make new power sources, by sitting on fields and rolling around. I've been a fool all this time!

    Take me to your leader, or as you and WTC7 would say(0)------(0)

    +--------+

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000631933465 Fecioru Florin

    Haha it has been a while since I saw nonsense. If I were to edit this video, I think I could split his in to a few different clips: crop circles, free energy, spirituality, conspiracy, economics, some actual science and then, just plain mambo jumbo talk.

  • Guest

    There went your chance with the Lady Gaga, she likes different.
    az

  • Achems_Razor

    Ha,Ha, right, won't comment on that, might be kiddies around. Quit leading me of topic. lol

  • Guest

    You could say that every "original and embryonic idea" was in it's infancy a pseudo science until it took hold in enough people's mind to become real science.
    Life doesn't know rest, it can take any direction, it is always going towards the unknown. The unknown is never real science until men says so.
    az

  • CANADAIAN

    If I build you a car from bits and pieces I bought on ebay would buy it? It uses a fraction of the energy of any other vehicle out there, I bought a coat rack for 2 bucks, should suffice as a front bumper and it comes with a bag of balloons for air bags. I didn't put speed control in so you go 60 kph or nothing. And I'm not positive that it won't explode and incinerate you at some point. What I'm getting is that crude prototypes made from pieces bought on the internet is a far cry from from a well designed and developed product thats undergone thorough testing and is held up to todays safety standards and still achieve what the product is intended to do. This all takes years and millions of dollars, whether its the taurus, cold fusion, or one of the machines built by the quacks he featured. Next we look into mass production, start finding suppliers for all.............

    Or maybe you think its as simple as "if you build it, they will come"

    Many things start as fantasy, a dream of one person, and thankfully those ppl are out there believing their fantasy or dream can become reality when no one else does. The idea of cold fusion has been around for a long time, and even now thousands of ppl are spending millions of dollars to make that fantasy real.

    Or maybe I'm missing your point, just gambles a quack and the taurus design is fantasy? He never said the taurus is a machine, I'm pretty sure, though.

    I have watched fusioneer, but ill watch it again to refresh my my memory. Pretty sure dr. howard isn't powering his home with his reactor though.

  • RikG01

    Azilda said "You could say that every "original and embryonic idea" was in it's infancy a pseudo science until it took hold in enough people's mind to become real science. "
    You could say that but if you did you would be spouting drivel. Pseudo-science is not science that is yet to be proven. It's charletenry which uses certain words and phrases in order to sound like science.

    @canadaian. Wishing on a star doesn't make things happen. Most people grow out of thinking that way. You're confusing dreams with fantasy and your analogy abuot a car made from coat-hangers is irrelevent straw-man nonsense. Saying that people have made scientific discoveries in the past and turn those discoveries into useable products, doesn't change the fact the Gamble is spewing rubbish. Gamble can pretend all he wants, you can fantasise that Gamble isn't lying all you want, it won't change the facts.

    The fact is that Thrive is just another in a long line of cons, aimed at members of the new-age movement who would rather fantasise better things, than make better things happen. It's so much easier if someone does it for you. Look up skeptoid's video "Here be Dragons". It will explain how to spot con-job, pseudo-scientific drivel. It describes what you see in the Thrive, perfectly.

  • http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/about/ Vlatko

    @RikG01,

    Spot on.

    1. Does the claim meet the qualifications of a theory? - Of course not. No scientific method, no predictions, no experiments. Nothing.

    2. Is the claim said to be based on ancient knowledge? - Probably yes. I mean the ancients were way wiser and smarter than us.

    3. Was the claim first announced through mass media, or through scientific channels? - Yes, they made a $8 mil documentary and they were advertising it a lot.

    4. Is the claim based on the existence of an unknown form of "energy" or other paranormal phenomenon? - Of course yes. Taurus and crop circles.

    5. Do the claimants state that their claim is being suppressed by authorities?. I'm not sure about this but instead of going through valid scientific channels they choose to appeal to audience.

    6. Does the claim sound far fetched, or too good to be true? - Simply Yes.

    7. Is the claim supported by hokey marketing? - Lots of it. Probably they've spent more on marketing than on making the documentary itself.

    8. Does the claim pass the Occam's Razor test? - Not even close.

    9. Does the claim come from a source dedicated to supporting it? Yes. There is no real institution behind this.

    etc ...
    etc ...
    etc ...

    Conclusion: This is pseudoscience of unseen proportions.

    And no... pseudoscience is not the beginning of real science.

  • CANADAIAN

    I have watched here be dragon and in fact. both good docs. So I'm understanding your just going to run with what they say. good for you.

  • RikG01

    Ummm no, I've applied what each video has suggested to what I already know, judged each based on merits derived from information which I know to clearly be fact. I've compared each to other sources of information which I know to look for correlation. I've judged each based on peer reviews of people who DO know what they are talking, who HAVE studied these things in depth and who HAVE come to their conlusions based on evidence, test, research. On the basis of what is proven to be true, I haev decided that skeptoid's work deserves serious consideration, where Fg's work deserves serous derision. See how Vlatko has examined the evidence, compare it for yourself.

    You seem to think that I'm just some hater. You haven't any idea why I would be a hater, all you know is that I disagree with thrive and my objection is based on reasoning. But rather than question the reasoning and asking whether it is valid, you'd rather just attack me.

    I'm not against you. I'm not against new ideas, on the contrary I love science for it's advancement and look forward to, even marvel at new ideas. What I object to is con-men, who seek to pervert and abuse good, well meaning people, by playing on their desires for a better world, a more spiritual way, a better humanity.

    Look at my objections again. Look at the reasons. Don't just react with hostility, because I disagree. Think!

  • WTC7

    Charming :). Disarming sense of humor, lol. Cheers!

  • CANADAIAN

    I see no hostility in my responses or comments, nor did I mean to give the notion your a hater. I do dislike your arrogant and demeaning way you respond to most ppl on here though. You give the air of Im right your wrong! Check my past posts, never have I praised gamble or this documentary. Its just another doc. ppl see things how they want. You see my posts as I'm supporting or defending thrive. When my view is Ive never done any such thing, just asked questions and gave opinions. Never took a side so to speak. Everybody picks their side, I don't feel I need to. Crop circles, my opinion is its ppl, logic says so. And thats the first I've said here of my true opinion on it. But I'm not content to say thats a final answer, theres more to it than a hoax. Dunnings work is good, interesting. But seems to me he can view everything as black and white, yes or no answers. I find little in my life is so black and white, little in this world is simply black and white

  • Guest

    You are the one being hostile:
    "Aww bless ya, look at you trying to think."
    "If you'd any sense, you wouldn't defend this carp, you'd realise it for what it is."

    Why are you in such frenzy? I have 5 physical senses just like you and perhaps i am able to access additional senses because i make them part of my life. We create our reality. Science limits itself to physical reality, until that changes, the non physical world will remain a mystery.
    11 dimensions? i say bring them on!
    You can use this comment to attact my intelligence, i am used to that on TDF. Still I rarely (not to say never) attack others...no point in it.
    az

  • Guest

    "it is all too common for people to assume that everything that is not black is completely white, everything that is not white is completely black, everything that is not perfect is worthless, everything that is not completely true is completely false, their friends are always good and their enemies are always evil, et cetera."
    a quote from don't know who.
    az

  • rawbot

    I remember watching this, when it came out in November of last year. I was really looking forward to it, because even before it's release there was this hype about a movie coming out on 11.11.11 and how it's going to be ground-shaking to say the least. I won't go into details of what my thoughts were just yet, because I intend to watch it again before I get too specific, but let's just say I was utterly disappointed. I had some trouble at first finding a copy on youtube that wasn't removed because of copyright infringement, which was funny since the ones who requested the removal were the guys from Clear Compass Media which is the production company behind Thrive. So I found it really weird that an altruistic (self-proclaimed, ofcourse) and benevolent man, that supposedly spent 8 million $ on this "documentary", would go to such lengths to actually prevent his movie from being seen by as many people as possible and rather sell it exclusively for 5$, especially if it really had any solutions or groundbreaking science in it. And he is a P&G heir for crying out loud, it's not like he had to get that 8 million $ back or he couldn't eat.

  • RikG01

    No frenzy, just fact vs fiction. Look at Vlatko's post again. Look at my links again. The non-physical world is irrelevent in this argument anyway because we're not talking about power supplied by gods, or solutions created by ghosts.
    Thrive puts forward ideas which are based in the physcial world, which affect the physical world. The form and usage of energy also follows these rules, however futuristic or alien the source. Thrive must therefor be judged by what we know about the physical world. What we know disproves everything in the film.
    If you want a better world, don't hope for space-fairies to do something, go out and join a movement like occupy or the political party of your choice. Get educated about the real facts of the world. Make a difference through discourse and couragous, peaceful action.

    Little green men aren't coming to our rescue. We have to help each other. Even if they were, I'm pretty sure they's want us to look after each other til they get here. Otherwise, why would they want to help us?

  • Earthwinger

    Canadaian, there's a couple of problems with your strawman argument, the first one being this....the purpose of building test rigs is to test a theory, not to sell it on. It's standard practice for inventors/scientists to build small scale test rigs of any novel device. How else would you know that it would perform as expected if you didn't? And how else would you convince other people that it worth investing time or money in, other than by blagging vulnerable people?

    And ironically, the second problem actually proves my point for me! You mentioned that there would need to be years of research and development. So tell me.....without some sort of test rig, what is there to research and develop, other than a nifty idea? That's the whole point of building a test rig.

    Test rigs are generally, cheap, and small scale. Their purpose is to demonstrate a principle, and provide a model that can be perfected.. There is no test rig for the torus device, and there never will be because it's utter bilge. It's a fantasy.

    I have nifty ideas all the time. One of them involves a static charge powered skateboard using sticky thistles, which abound in nature (well they do round my way), and the dust bunnies underneath my bed, which certainly abound in my house! I mulled over and developed the concept over a period of years. I spent a great deal of time contemplating potential uses for dust bunnies, whilst looking for knickers under my bed, and I combined this with my years of experience in picking sticky thistles off my dogs ass. It'll work, trust me! ;)

  • CANADAIAN

    I think the problem is your still talking like the taurus is a free power machine in gambles head. I didn't get that impression at all from what was in the doc. You'll have to give me the time slot in the doc where he states the taurus is a free power machine.

    And you pointed out "fusioneer". Dr. Howard states that his test rig is not a feasible application, 3 years and thousands invested for him to learn how to build the next better test rig. Not to mention his access to materials at the university he works at that is not for sale on ebay. Or even affordable for the home inventor to buy. Since Gamble never said the taurus is a machine that can be built, I can't directly argue why gamble never spent his 8 million to build something he never even mention.
    To me I think the real question you should have asked is "Why didn't gamble invest his 8 million in one of the inventors he featured, or Dr, Howard, cold fusion research..... I'll agree there is a lot better ways to spend 8 million than on this doc. But its his 8 mill.

  • Earthwinger

    Phew.....whoever it was that "liked" that post, thank you! I was on 666 likes for a while back there! :)

  • rawbot

    This thing is hilarious! I forgot how ret*rded it made me feel the first time I saw it, you can imagine my feelings now, the second time around. :) The first scene where it says that all facts presented were independently confirmed. Haha. Which facts exactly, are you effin kidding me? The fact that you can put a torus shape around everything you can imagine if it's big enough (the torus shape that is)? I mean, hey, I can say that the most basic, natural shape is the sphere and that atoms are in the shape of the sphere not torus and it would be more correct, because just by superimposing images of toruses on things that exist, you don't validate your "theory" that you had a vision of when you were riding on a bus to school. Are you serious? Quants are in the shape of torus?? And photons are in the shape of torus? Just by mentioning that Einstein discovered the photoelectric effect that doesn't give credence to the "torus" theory in any way. You wrongly depicted the atom and the photons as toruses so to convince people that have very little physics knowledge into believing that Einstein somehow already knew it was all about the torus.
    I still don't buy that this movie cost 8M$. CGI is so cheap to make these days (even good one) and this was really mediocre. Even the opening titles were yuck (the flying 3d golden letters written with an ugly font at 6:55). Maybe they needed 8M for all the stock video clips, I don't know.

  • RikG01

    Except there is no Taurus. It's a fabrication supported only by fallacious arguments. So whatever impression you got of it from this film - and it is a film, not a documentary, documentaries are presentation of facts, however incorrect the conclusions - isn't really relevent.

    Asking why FG didn't invest is like arguing why Warners Brothers didn't hire actual wizards to so the special effects, instead of using CGI to make the Harry Potter films.

    You can't invest in something that doesn't exist.

  • Pysmythe

    I'm sorry, Az, but Rik is NOT the one who started the personal hostility. His first post wasn't directed at anyone in particular, just a general, passionate statement about faulty thinking. Then two very personal darts get hurled at his feet.

    I know YOU would be likely to react very differently, but you shouldn't try pinning the blame on him because he was responding how he was responded to!

  • Pysmythe

    Yes... I know how much that must've terrified you. :)
    *cue ominous choirs*

  • CANADAIAN

    Um, isn't that what I said???

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/5GLQ2HFV2OO3EFVHA6GA2G5FLI Kairo

    I watched it with no background about movement or this doc, and its simpleton cult creation. If anyone watches it and is moved by it, you probably should join that cult. This documentary is like comunism propaganda, science fiction and torus biology class in one.

  • dewflirt

    Must be the child in me still enjoying the odd fairytale, sometimes nice to revel in the mystery even when you know has a perfectly mundane explanation. Such indulgence! So yes, I don't care, I like them for what they are. Environmental art :)

  • rawbot

    Wow! I'm not sure I'm going to be able to watch this cr*pumentary again. It hurts the brain! :) In two minutes it manages to spew out so much nonsense it is hard to process and address it all.

    Oranges and apples are in the shape of the torus?! Really?
    "We're travelling in this boundless sea of infinite torus flow. Torus is like the breath of the universe. It's the form that the flow of energy takes at every scale of existence."
    Yeah right. What is torus flow exactly? A torus shape is like a breath of the universe?? What does that mean?! Energy flow takes the form of the torus at every scale? And the evidence for this is? Or at least some sort of theory? Like some mathematical equations at least, so other scientists can calculate and see if they come to the same conclusions - that we have to pursue "the path of the torus". :)
    Nassim Haramein - snake oil salesman extraordinaire - If I remember correctly I once saw a "lecture" (it might even be here on topdocs) by this same fraud, in which he told the story that was identical to Gamble's story, about him having a vision how the universe works on a bus, when he was a boy.

  • Pysmythe

    Never worry about telling them what they WANT to hear! (lol)
    I'm enjoying your posts immensely.

  • Pysmythe

    They are terra-fic looking, aren't they? :)
    I think they should start holding crop-circle contests: Put those bright young beavers from CalTech on this sh*t, and see what kind of complexities they can come up with!

  • CANADAIAN

    The 2nd part of your statement is completely inaccurate. And take my comments as you like but I feel there was a line crossed from passionate statement to rude. And wtc never said anything to provoke the statement az quoted.

  • WTC7

    Your arrogance is your enemy. What is fiction for you, for some people, including respectable scientists, is just an area that requires more research as no definitive answers have been yet provided. Trying to intimidate people is a sign of ultimate weakness and absence of any kind of evidence to offer.

    "Thrive must therefor(e) be judged by what we know about the physical world. What we know disproves everything in the film."

    Without trying to prove or disprove anything in this specific documentary, I am asking you what is it exactly that you know about physical world? If you consider that you know it all than don't even bother to respond, it will be ignored as self-delusional ranting.

    The Universe exists for more than 13 billion years. What we call civilization on Earth is around for some 8000 years give or take. In a billions of years old Universe there could exist civilizations that came to be billions of years ago and saying that they could not have developed technologies to travel between stars, even galaxies, is simply ridiculous. Of hundreds of thousands of UFOs reported throughout centuries, of which many are hoaxes or simple ignorance I admit especially in the recent period, that tiny percentage of unexplained phenomena is enough to make an inquisitive mind to think. Why the Martians have not said "hallo" to you in English or to me in my native language is something I cannot give you an explanation for. It's trivial and not an argument, except for a shallow intellect, in any serious discussion on the topic.

    Space fairies exist in your mind only, because understanding the possibility of alien life does not exclude fighting for justice and freedom here on Earth. You are probably from the US, I would imagine, with that kind of limited perception of the world around you. Please don't talk to me about resistance to governments because I spent my youth in the streets against my own and I understand quite well where the current global monetary system is leading this world to. If you are a part of the Occupy movement you have my respect, but don't teach me about resistance, please.

    Just one more thing before I finish, "the form and usage of energy" does not necessarily follow the physical rules we know in classical physics, you would know that if you were just a bit acquainted with the quantum physics (real, not pseudo-science mind you).

  • dewflirt

    Nerd with planck! No good can come of it. This is a job for a geek, set fazers to stun and level the crops!!!!

  • Pysmythe

    Please show me precisely where Rik was rude to you in his initial response. And then you clearly insulted him FOR that response, I'm sorry.

    And while I've always liked WTC7 very much, her comment WAS dripping with sarcasm, which often begets the same thing as a result.

  • Pysmythe

    I'm pleased to note the precision of your definitions!
    Engage.

  • Achems_Razor

    @WTC7:

    Go get them! I've got your back, what you have said makes sense to me, and yes physical rules that we know in classical physics RE: Newtonian and Einsteinian, fall by the wayside in quantum mechanics/physics, they just don't jive. No marriage at all, they hate each other, especially gravity.

    I can go further down the rabbit hole as probably everyone knows but that should suffice for now.

  • RikG01

    FG made the claims through Thrive, it's FG's burden of proof, not mine. I can turn your question on you, provide evidence for any of FG's claims. Why would you even suggest that I'd think we "know it all"? That's just another fallacious attack, used because you have no evidence to support your position. You're trying to make my position look outragous in order to make yours look like it's based on reason.

    As for the world, we know a great many things. Your suggestions that there may have been older civilisations is moot as there is no evidence of them either having existed or even potentially having existed. Besides, I've not questioned the possibilty of extra-terrestrial life, only challenged this bizarre notion that they would be incapable of communicating with us in any way that doesn't involve squashing plants. It would be a strangely evolved race of creatures that requires acres of arable land to put forward ideas. I don't know about you, but I'm not in the habit of carrying around a decidous forest, incase I wish to say hello.

    I don't need to explain physics, thermo-dynamics, gravity, strong force, weak forces etc etc in order to disprove such as Torus because there is no evidence of Torus existing. It's just more fallacious argument, with no evidence, no examination, no testing, no peer review. Nothing. Without that, I'm sorry to say, your argument and Thrive falls down to "self-delusional ranting".

    Thrive and FG, fail burden of proof, fail Occams Razor, fail scientific method. It's barely classifiable as even pseudo-science, based as it is entirely on fantasy. Even the sections of the film which are based on fact, are missappropriated and abused so as to be unrecognisable. It's not a documentary, it's a film. It's not a blueprint to peace, it's a con to make more money from people who want peace.

  • RikG01

    You're quite correct, I have been a little rude, as Brennilthos64 (thanks Brennilthos64) pointed out, in reaction to clear sarcasm and your comment which implied I was narrow minded. I apologise for shortness in response to such behavior.

    I won't however, apologise for pointing out where the defences of this ridiculous film are lacking in reason. So far the entirity of the comments supporting FG have amounted to "yeah, well crop circles COULD be made by aliens, you're closed minded!" and "torus MIGHT exist, you don't know!". Which are hardly sound arguments.

    Show me where this film isn't codswollop. That's all I ask. Demonstrate one iota of evidence. Provide one credible link to third party peer review which supports it. Show me where there Torus is held in ANY kind of esteem by the scientific community.

    Of course, if you can get any through all those darn government conspiracies *skoff*.

  • dewflirt

    Don't want to get the geeks mad, they might L.A.R.P at me ;)

  • WTC7

    I am often sarcastic, but there was no sarcasm in any of my comments on this doc

  • RikG01

    Thrive isn't a documentary. Documentaries are based on facts, however skewed their conclusions. Thrive is made of fantasy, conspiracy-theory and con-artistry. And of course fail.

    @dewflirt

    LMAO Nice one, I don't care who it's directed at, too funny.

  • Pysmythe

    What does the United Republican Party of Latvia have to do with anything?! lolol. :)

  • WTC7

    I was very specific in saying that what I wrote was not to prove or disprove anything said in this documentary. Therefore, most of your reply concerning FG is irrelevant.

    Explaining to me the quantum forces you refer to is not what I asked for and your reply clearly states that you don't even understand what I talked about.

    The issue of crop circles and the argument related to allien communication you put forth is speculation presented in a manner of a primary school child and is below standards of an educated adult. You will have to start respecting others' opinions, no matter how ludicrous they may seem to you, and providing counter argument in a respectful manner, if you want to be taken seriously.

  • rawbot

    I feel there are way too many comments focusing on the crop circles alone. What I mean is it has nothing to do with anything in this documentary. It's just one of many ploys with which they try to convince you that what they're saying must be right, because nobody really can explain (all of the) crop circles and everyone knows it's a mystery, and half of the people already believe they are of extraterrestrial origin. I don't know what to think about them, what I do know is they have no connection with the torus or at least not in the way they showed it. The bubbly picture (the Flower of Life symbol that was "burned into atomic structure".. ??? WTF? How can you burn something into the atomic structure?) really can be a 2d projection of a number of 3d structures. And I don't see how the tetrahedron fits torus any more than it does a sphere.

    But as far as the crop circles go, I just know I haven't seen anyone show on video how to make a proper one. I know that there was the Firefox logo, but it was really unimpressive (it was mainly just a large flattened silhouette of the logo, not really like the detailed ones with dozens (even hundreds?) of lines and circles) and it took 20 students about 3 weeks (if my memory serves me right). Anyway it took them a lot more than overnight. One theory someone suggested and it could as well be true is that the crop circles are some sort of calibration exercises for the military (laser?) satellites. If so, they must be having a laugh! It would definitely explain why the resolution of the crop circles is getting better every year. Also it would be in sync with observations that some crop circles are perfect circles from the air but the terrain is slanted and uneven. So they had to be projected from the air or someone took the terrain into account when stomping them on the ground to look circular from the air. I know which is more likely.

    And to reply to somebody that was baffled how come "the aliens didn't learn English"... Just to repeat, I'm not saying I believe it's done by aliens or that it proves that crop circles are of alien origin (to me it's almost contrary, it is more plausible for aliens to not try to communicate with us in English or any other specific language), but you should get your facts straight. One of the complex "crop circles" that appeared in Chilbolton (UK) featured an alien face with a disc with binary code "printed" on it. It was in English language, coded in standard ASCII code.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_ZJRXQ6RHS5QPRP3QX5HZDKRZLE Jeremy

    Thanks, I was about to roast him for that ignorant statement : )

  • dewflirt

    U.R.P.L. ? What have they got to do with the Light Aircraft Repair Package? :)

  • WTC7

    Documentaries, just like anything else in this world, are based on perceived facts. For example, you may consider yourself to be solid, made of solid flesh and bones, but in scientific reality - factual situation - you are empty space. Now, that is a solid proven fact, lol.

  • Teddy Mcd

    Hmm... Is that right then.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_ZJRXQ6RHS5QPRP3QX5HZDKRZLE Jeremy

    I saw a "crop circle debunking" show a LOOONGG time ago, and I got all excited, because I wanted to prove to my ex that they were man-made.

    They go through this whole shindig about how they are one of the original crews, that they started the fad, and detailed how they do it etc. So at the end of the show, after claiming credit for a bounty of circles, and attributing others to still other groups; The show takes them to a large field, and asks them to do the world a favor, end the dispute, and bring us the most epic crop circle ever.

    There were probably 30 guys on this "crop circle" team and they were equipped with all kinds of random "tools". They went to work, the cameras left, and the next scene is supposedly the next morning. The crop circle was simply the word "debunked" and my ex started laughing. It was immediately obvious to even me the difference in quality between the "professionals that supposedly create these things" and the massive, intricate, precisely formed crop circles that people usually refer to as "the real deal" I mean, it was pathetic, you could see their footprints and marks from their equipment, the angles were nowhere near perfect, it was decent caligraphy, but nowhere near the quality or size of the big ones. I mean, it was maybe 100' x 100' and roughly 40% of that area was actually pressed over to make the design.

    Tiny.

    If those are the men behind the "crop circles" then I can only laugh and wonder how much they were paid to learn this craft and claim this as their work lmao!

    It was a lot like watching an episode of myth busters, except at the end you were more skeptical than before they started. I tried to find the show, but I can't seem to, if anyone remembers what it was called plz post, would be a nice short doc to add.

    It was on mainstream networks, and it was right after the first waves of them started appearing, so probly like, 2 years before Signs was made.

    I mean I get it, aliens bending corn to communicate technology to us seems r*tarded to even me, but to be a fair critic on the topic, I have yet to see a debunking that left me grinning with the guaranteed knowledge they were all done by human hands.

  • CANADAIAN

    How about where he referred to me as kid, don't tell me it was in a fun way, or when he told me to grow up.

  • rawbot

    Not all lasers are visible to our sight. In fact, the more powerful ones (the ones used in laser cutters and alike) are very often invisible (e.g. CO2 lasers) and often have another visible laser just for us to see where they are aiming.

    But who knows, maybe it's not lasers after all... It could be something so top secret we don't even know of.

  • rawbot

    Is what right? What exactly are you referring to?

  • Achems_Razor

    @WTC7:

    There you go, you hit it right on the head, everything and I mean everything is empty space, everything is made up of atoms, and atoms are 99.0000000% empty. All matter, time and spacetime is illusion. We make everything we see by collapsing the waveform, even "crop circles", oh, it is all still there all right but flickering in and out of our spacetime continuum but unrecognizable until we look, who says so? a long list of quantum physicists.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_ZJRXQ6RHS5QPRP3QX5HZDKRZLE Jeremy

    I would say that if you honestly believe that in this massive universe, there is not one sentient race more advanced than us that has discovered technologies we cannot grasp and is willing to help other civilizations to gain this advantage as well; And your sole reasoning is because we don't have any hard facts.

    I have to say it's MRI time.

    To me the anti-alien arguments seem like the arguments of medieval people claiming flat earth, because they hadn't seen it from space, they felt the need to belittle anyone that disagreed.

    The logic and the statistics and the smartest minds on the planet agree with me. However, if the universe is indeed empty, the difference is that NO ONE got hurt because of our beliefs, the beliefs you put forth actually could damage progress.

    As I have stated before. This forum needs less absolutists, I can willingly admit that things are possible and I attempt to keep an open mind. Avoiding absolutism is critical to thought. You must realize this.

  • WTC7

    @ Jeremy,

    I am sorry, but I don't think I ever advanced anything you suggest in your comment. On the contrary, I am in absolute agreement with what you say.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_ZJRXQ6RHS5QPRP3QX5HZDKRZLE Jeremy

    Lol, then apparently somewhere I clicked the wrong person, or misread you, spot on and apologies : )

  • Pysmythe

    Your post beginning "Occam's Razor, er, yes..."
    If that whole thing isn't sarcasm, what is it, irony?
    Clearly, you think I have a reading comprehension problem, but whatever blows your hair back! Whatever you want to call it, it was intended as an insult.
    You know it, and I know it.
    But WTF, WTC?

    You know what?
    I'm just gonna let it go.

  • Achems_Razor

    I don't believe it! What is up with all this nancy pansy hurt my feelings cr@p. Everyone grow a pair and stay with the topic, all except you of course WTC7.

  • Pysmythe

    My feelings aren't hurt in the least, nor did I suggest that... I was simply voicing surprise that @WTC7 won't even admit to the obvious. Az implied @Rik, in essence, "got what he deserved" because HE started hurling insults at people, which is BS, if anyone cares to read the order of the posts, and I was simply clearing her up on that.

    So then... if YOU have some problem with my responding to WTC7's obfuscation about the matter, that's your dilemma, isn't it? And...you know... you REALLY don't do this site any credit by implying there are different sets of rules for different people.

  • Achems_Razor

    Don't take it to heart to much, was not implying anything, if you think I was then I apologize, everybody has the same rules, even me.

    Just want you all to drop unrelated bickering back and forth, please read the "comment policy above".

  • Pysmythe

    Actually, I feel rather silly about the whole thing, because it wasn't even my "fight" to begin with... I just felt the need to clear up a point with Azilda, and it went from there somewhere I never intended.

  • mor4humanity

    Pressurized water? It is simply keeping a siphon pool full via weep holes...

    How complicating of you...

  • Guest

    Looks like i've missed the flow while having my hand in the dough...doughnut.....torus....lolol
    I'll answer back a few comments.
    az

  • http://www.facebook.com/dami.akomolafe Dami Akomolafe

    whateva dude. I hope u one day decide to dream for something better for us all... I think maybe you should tell us where you find the fantasy, and con-artistry?... Are you not the con-artist?

    Don't rip on people who want to make things better... that's just weird....Well some people like sadomasochism I guess....But I kinda want to better myself... Don't you? I want to help myself and those around me, you don't?

    You need a big hug! :) Its okay to dream my friend! no need to be scared.... I'm not being sarcastic....infact seeing this as sarcastic is fear itself....Do you live paralysed by fear? why? Is that how you want to live? do you see that as easier and more comfortable than daring to dream?

    This is what your statement gives me...

  • Pysmythe

    Throw some flower(s) on us before we rise up! :)

  • Guest

    Don't be sorry...
    He stated:
    "If you'd any sense, you wouldn't defend this carp, you'd realise it for what it is." and ended his comment with Grow up...i gave him my opinion on senses.
    Grow up...what's old enough? lol
    az

  • Guest

    Rik dissagrees with some of the comments and he is identifying all of them to all the people who made a statement or two he dissagree with.
    az

  • Guest

    May be the gang who meet at Stonehenge every year have a pass time between solstice.
    az
    edit: Ho shite, i used may be!

  • Guest

    You mean flour? az

  • Pysmythe

    Flower= flour, yeah.

  • Guest

    Time to celebrate 3000th comment, i thought i'd picked a word at random in a book and my index fell on "Sharing". Had to laugh!
    Sharing with you all has been time consuming to say the least, but i have enjoyed typing every letters. More to come if time permits...i don't have as much free time as i used to, but i'm loving it!
    There's nothing like "Mettre la main à la pâte".
    BRAVO VLATKO!
    az

  • Pysmythe

    Congratulations!

    It dawned on me the other day in an idle moment that you've probably written a fairly sizable book by now, all told. If you take the average post length as being 50 words, that comes out to 150,000 words altogether, which would make a standard-sized paperback of nearly 600 pages!

  • Earthwinger

    “Pressurized water? It is simply keeping a siphon pool full via weep holes...”

    That's not what you said in your original post.

    I'm not entirely sure what you mean when you say "keeping a siphon pool full via weep holes" but I assume you mean there would be a container full of water. If that's the case, then the stored water is a form of potential energy. So by spinning a prop with it, you'd simply be converting potential energy into kinetic energy, which wouldn't defy the laws of physics in any way. ;)

  • WTC7

    True, my apologies, I did forget about that post and, yes, it was sarcastic.

  • RikG01

    Wow, you sound like a scientologist. Sorry, I know that's pretty insulting. Just pointing at your argument. No fear, here and I have dreams. Thrive isn't either of those. It's a rich guy trying to get you to give hom money and make way for further tax breaks for the rich.

    He doesn't want to make things better. To believe that is naive, at best. As I already said, people who want to make things better are great! I love new ideas but those ideas have to stand up to reality and not be cons. Which is pretty easy to prove. To accuse me of wanting to be comfortable is the most arrogant, ignorant, nonsensical claim you could have made. It demonstrates just how utterly closed minded and foolish you are. I spend my days fighting FOR people, trying to make a better future. Unlike you, I don't need magical, space-fairies to change things for me.

    If you want the world to be better, don't rely on charlatans and just HOPE that they are correct. We have the tools to identify, drivel and wishful-thinking and thus reject them. WE also have the tools to improve things without drivel and wishful-thinking.

  • RikG01

    I'm sorry, for being so forward in my posting Az. I'm pretty passionate when it comes to exposing frauds who have the intention of harming or taking advantage of peoples hopes for profit. Sometimes I don't understand how people can't see obvious charlatanry quite as easily. Please don't make the assumption now that I see everything as con-artistry.

    Thrive clearly fits the bill. As do crop circles. and scientology. And magnet therapy.

    The republican Party In the US

    Conservatives, in the UK

    Faith healers

    Psychic sally

    I'll stop now

  • dewflirt

    Ha, a bunch of druids with time on their hands, scuffing about in fields. Wonder why it's always crop circles, why not snow or sand or meadow circles? Might be something to do with easy access, difficult to cover your tracks in anything else. Maybe you did it during an out of body experience, Az-tral Traveling ! ;)

  • rawbot

    Actually there are accounts of "snow circles" with no footprints leading to them.. I remember seeing it in a doc somewhere. But I'm not sure they are as complex as the crop ones.

  • Achems_Razor

    Az...congrats on your 3000 comments. Cause for a celebration.

  • dewflirt

    Had a quick look, some quite complicated designs but it seems they all have been claimed by humans. Oh well ;)

  • Spiri Rosetti

    Same old chit-chat, in this 2 hour movie there is not one real world working solution. None, just the same politics!

  • Magic_Bliss

    It's fascinating ( and long awaited ) that a non-linear and harmonized meeting of Spirit and Science have finally evolved to meet at a level of consciousness (one) .. and at the 'pyramids peak'! So If the planet could only let go of the illusory concept of time, there is much potential for this to work :)

  • PickMyName

    Az, saying "may be" is perfectly fine. You can even say "may well be" if you want.

  • PickMyName

    Could you elaborate? Science says that energy and matter are the same. It's how nuclear bombs and energy plants work. And there is enough energy in one cubic centimeter of space ... about the size of your little pinky tip ... to create an amount matter to equal the amount in the known universe. That there is a whole lot of energy right in your hand!
    So just tap a miniscule amount of that and ... infinite free energy.

    And then there's Tesla....

  • PickMyName

    Whos's putting energy into the system? The system itself puts water up in the sky. And gravity pressurizes it.

    Lots of people seem to miss the point that the universe is not a closed system. Newton's laws only apply to closed systems. And his laws aren't good enough to accurately measure the orbit of Mercury.

    I'm not taking anything away from Newton, but we've stood on his shoulders and learned things since his day. And by "we" I mean people much more educated than I am.

  • PickMyName

    Do you feel that TopDoc picks and chooses which docs to put up? You may be right, but I thought they put up all the docs they can find.

  • Earthwinger

    Ok, I could have worded that better, but I was trying to keep it simple.

    He's constructed a system which, using the potential energy of water, via the restoring force of gravity, generates kinetic energy. Is that better? :)

    My point was, that he hadn't, as he claimed, defied the laws the physics. ;)

  • PickMyName

    James Clerk Maxwell, Nikola Tesla, Albert Einstein; pseudo-scientists all.

  • PickMyName

    Agreed.
    It's generally accepted that bipedalism was a major development leading to our ability to use tools, which lead to writing, etc.

    P.S. Please send me a glow-in-the-dark coin! Canadians are awfully cool.

  • PickMyName

    If you can -- in actuality -- replace his torus with something else, I really hope you do. However, I think the torus is what he ended up with, not what he started from. So if you can find something else that works, that would be wonderful. And wouldn't it be cool if you tried, and ended up with the torus as well? That's how science works. Someone does something and someone else tries to replicate it.

    So please, try it with a triangle, or try it any way you can, and see if you get a different shape than a torus.

  • PickMyName

    Alternating current was considered "perpetual energy", and thus a pseudo-science.

    And I hope you're not going to do the James Randi trick of making the conditions impossible to meet, i.e. "'alternating current' isn't a science" and that sort of junk. Well, everyone will see it, so I guess it's ok if you want to go that route.

  • PickMyName

    Funny how your arguments degraded into "if this, then why not that?"

    What evidence do you have that all crop circles are fake? None, of course. Why do you think that everyone, regardless of what planet or culture they're from, agree with your logic? I can think of at least five answers to each of your questions; can't you?

    And, crop circles have been around since at least the 1800's, so, no, the "first makers" did not come out with videos.

    "If I can fake a photo of a UFO, all photos of UFO's are fake."

  • PickMyName

    Snap! "someone should film the hoaxers making one of the sophisticated patterns in one day. That would put an end to this."

    I'm gonna steal this! Don't be surprised if you see this posted elsewhere on the net!

  • PickMyName

    Yeah! Some spiders have two! How cool would that be! Oh, wait. They have two in case the first one breaks off.
    Never mind.

  • PickMyName

    Many of the people who believe in aliens, including astronauts, believe that we're related.

  • PickMyName

    Apparently they're made by some sort of energy vortex...no physical ship needed. Oh, and "someone should film the hoaxers making one of the sophisticated patterns in one day. That would put an end to this."
    Oingo Boingo.

  • PickMyName

    We're still learning why ants do what they do. Much of their behavior seems mysterious. Yet so many of us seem so sure of alien behavior. Odd logic.

    Oh, and "someone should film the hoaxers making one of the sophisticated patterns in one day. That would put an end to this."

  • PickMyName

    In the case of so-called "cold fusion", positive results continue to come in. The most interesting thing about that phenomenon, which goes by many names, is excess tritium.

    But the current "scientific method" is to slander the scientists and belittle their findings. For example, in some cases, cold fusion works "only" 3 out of 10 times. Scientifically, only once should be needed to prove the concept. Yet it's relegated to "pseudo-science".

    So science doesn't really work as advertised.

  • PickMyName

    Totally agree! So far the human ones look like somebody tipped a cow and she struggled to get up. It would be nice to see what educated people could do. And remember, no breaking of stalks! And bring your microwave oven; and... and... and....

  • PickMyName

    Dude, you're ranting like a lunatic on meth.

    But you kinda have to, these days, to speak scientifically about the universe. Ah, for the days of Newton, when science makes sense.

  • http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/about/ Vlatko

    @PickMyName,

    1. Don't call people lunatics on meth. If you don't understand what Achems said, there is no need of insults. Follow the comment policy.

    2. You've posted 13 comments in an hour (not that there is a limit), but it seems that the people struck a nerve here?

    3. You imply that Einstein, Tesla etc. were all pseudo-scientists, which is completely untrue. They were putting forward their ideas through the proper scientific procedure, peer-review process. They were not making pamphlets, adverts or any kind of trickery like these charlatans today. So my question is why this guy made a documentary instead of publishing a paper for peer-review? You know the answer. It is BS, that's why.

    4. You ask what evidence do we have that all crop circles are fake? Wait a minute, I thought the one who is making the claim has to prove beyond reasonable doubt that their claim is valid. What are the evidence that they're maid by aliens or energy vortexes? Your argument is religious in nature. It says: Prove that my God doesn't exist.

    5. Yes, the behavior of the ants is a mystery to some extent, and so is the behavior of any other species on Earth, including homo sapiens. Is that a reason to be devoid of using any logic while thinking? I don't think so. Simply the idea that aliens are visiting this planet regularly and decided just to make crop circles is really laughable.

    6. You say energy vortex eh? Judging by the shape of the crop art it must be some sort of intelligent energy vortex involved. Why would those poor aliens send or create energy vortexes just to make those funny pictures in the fields. Put yourself in a spaceship, give yourself the ability to travel with enormous speeds, and the ability to create energy vortexes at will, and after many years of travel you're in front of some small average planet with life form on it. What would you do?

    7. According to you the current "scientific method" is to slander the scientists and belittle their findings. It was always like that, which is good. If it wasn't like that there would be no science. Only mockery and guess work would be left. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Hint: The head of the experiment that appeared to show subatomic particles travelling faster than the speed of light has resigned from his post. Too bad... the data showed that neutrinos after all are not faster than light and Einstein is still in the game.

    If you want to prove that cold fusion works you'll need 100% testable, verifiable, repeatable evidence that could be replicated all the time, every time. Sorry... that's the way how science work, like it should.

  • CANADAIAN

    Personally vlatko, I find it laughable that you can presume to know what aliens wouldn't do. Lets presume you travel to another planet. You have the technology, the power. You get there, you hear them making strange sounds, you wanna understand what it is. So you just create a machine that can translate? Alright, now you can see their somewhat intelligent, after all they are able to litter allover the lower orbit of their planet. Also you can see they learned to utilized atomic energy, pretty obvious when the first use was to blow the living sh1t out of their own kind with it. You you learn the planet is covered in weapons, for what purpose, probably to kill each other from what you've seen thus far. So I'm guessing at this point you'll easily figure out that the planet has capital cities and you'll know which one your gonna stop at to make your appearance to the beings. Your also positive from what you seen that their smart enough that they won't lock you up for study or just shoot you. That doesn't matter anyways cuz you managed to travel to another planet with life on it, you wouldn't do that without inventing some sort of protection first. Who the h3ll would leave their planet without inventing force field body amour to protect them......... ahhh, I'm tired of typing.

  • Guest

    Who would have thought humans would write on papyrus before it was acknowledged? But they did.
    It appears to me that the crop circles are made from the air...UFO? What are UFO...unidentified flying object. IF we could confirm they are from out of space we would call them IFO.
    We have to stay open to possibilities because we do not know, at least not us little ordinary people. Does the GOV, Nasa knows? Who knows?
    az

  • axisofoil

    This film is a joke. All the talk about the revelation of a new energy source and then in their idea of utopia all we see is wind and solar eqiptment. What's up with that? The shrink says don't irritate the NWO or they will kill 90% of you in response. Just let them be because they are a ravinous catapillar knowing they must die? Then.......a butterfly? Who believes this c***? Why did they do a Ron Paul infomercial using a guy who believes we are all under the control of 4th dimensional, shape shifting, blood drinking reptilians? Go to the Thrive web site and they will try to convince you that we shouldn't have to vote on tuesdays.Change the day and it will solve everything. What am I missing here? Does it seem to anybody else that this information could have been put together by any id**t after spending 2 days on you tube?

  • Pysmythe

    True, but a lack of basic reasoning skills is somewhat at a surplus on planet earth, and too many people are buying...
    Astronauts are not immune, either, whatever their prestige.

  • CANADAIAN

    It just seems ridiculous to me to think this has been going on for hundreds of years and the answer is simply, "its a hoax". Perhaps some need to believe that just feel secure or comfortable day to day.

  • Pysmythe

    ...and which ones aren't human?
    And how would YOU know?
    Who says no stalks were broken, and how do they know that?
    Did they check them all, or were they simply talking about MOST of them?
    What difference would it make, anyway? They don't need to be to make a clear enough pattern, etc., etc.

    You're a wordy guy, Verbal Kint (you said to pick your name), and you weave a pretty good yarn, I'll give you that, but your intellectual gadfly, superficial facility just does not quite persuade, lol.

  • CANADAIAN

    "We have to stay open to possibilities because we do not know, at least not us little ordinary people. Does the GOV, Nasa knows? Who know?"

    I guess some on here aren't "little ordinary people"! Several seem to know!

  • CANADAIAN

    Verbal Kent? Lol. I might be wrong in doing so, but I would take that as a compliment!

  • Pysmythe

    I certainly intended it as a compliment. Verbal could shoot off a fusillade of sh*t like the devil himself, but when the facts finally rolled in, his version was shown to be... somewhat lacking, lol. And there isn't anything wrong with being an intellectual gadfly, either, necessarily. My favorite writer, in fact, was one of the biggest examples of that the world's ever seen.

  • http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/about/ Vlatko

    @CANADAIAN,

    You say you find it laughable that I can presume to know what aliens wouldn't do, but in the very next sentence you're presuming too. Isn't that odd?

    My presumption was only the most logical and the simplest, nothing more. I can also presume that aliens have no physical bodies at all, instead they're just morphed collective consciousness, but there would be no logical foundation behind that, only a wild speculation. Remember... Occam's razor.

  • http://www.facebook.com/dmahat Dpk Mht

    If we followed what you said.. and if you were wrong... may be we will make a better world for nothing.. :D lol
    __
    the joke was taken from cartoon i saw somewhere..

  • InsanePorcupine

    hey vlatko You don't have to believe me but you could look at this as evidence that crop circles at the very least were not made by people with boards. You may have heard of the palm islands in dubai yes? Well I believe there is a documentary about it on this site, anyway. To make the said palm islands the engineer said "The making of the island would not have been possible without GPS devices. Now the palm island when looked at from above are not even as perfect as the crop circles you see and yet took satellite technology and teams of engineers. The crop circles spring up overnight with astoundingly complex design period. I don't think anyone is arguing the complexity and perciseness of some of the crop circles. Just saying got a documentary about some guys actually making one. I would love to see that people without any gps or aerial technology making one of the more intricate crop circles. In my opinion you have to be naive to think that some guys with boards made them.

    Here MARK MY WORDS. I will believe people made them when I see it, period. I'm not saying aliens make them with energy vortexes because I frankly don't know but for you to claim they are fake like you have is also a religious belief. They are unexplained mysteries to asert otherwise is presumptuous.

  • CANADAIAN

    "You say you find it laughable that I can presume to know what aliens wouldn't do, but in the very next sentence you're presuming too. Isn't that odd?"

    I'm pretty sure it was clear I was presuming what YOU would do.

  • InsanePorcupine

    not all men......

  • Teddy Mcd

    Wow - an amazing debate - you all have going on. I see you are all at the top of your game. Kudos.

    Crop Cirles? Add them to the list of imponderables - you know, items like, life death, god no-god, free will determinism, and solipsism, and what is that tiny fly doing on my window anyway?

    Beautiful spring day here in Vanc. Hal-a-loo-ya.

  • InsanePorcupine

    i actually believe that the odds are relatively good.... if you beleive the univers is infinite. Also I do think similar structures would form very likely making humaniod life again. Yes there would be other random structures but there are reasons our form of life has flourished. Dolphin's have big brains too but lack the opposible thumbs. See how that works. I think that intelligent life has a higher chance of being humanoid than other forms but i think its likely that life would imitate what works no matter where you are in the universe. even silicon based life would probably still need legs and a mouth and a nerve cluster where you have senses of some kind and it would logically evolve in a way that benifeited it meaning probably the nerve cluster would be in front to you know, see where your going. You can imagine an animal with eyes and a nose on it's ass but i think thats unlikely. Anywho just my thoughts.

  • http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/about/ Vlatko

    @CANADAIAN,

    Yes, but you're still presuming and at the same time you're telling me not to presume. I was just pointing that out.

  • InsanePorcupine

    what you never get board. Explain trophy hunting to an alien better yet tell them why millions of women get their clitoris forcible removed to dull there pleasure so they are less likely to cheat on their husbands. Why do you try to think you have any idea what an alien would do much less a redneck with a UFO just imagine that for a second. You don't think there are alien rednecks. Just saying maybe they just like drawing in fields. Explain why people make art for instance or people all come together and pretend they are in medieval days. Also you presume that aliens havnt talked to people on earth maybe they have just not you clearly. You also presume that we would be able to understand their advanced concepts in english. Try describing routers modems and other computer devices without those words we made to describe them to a species that has no idea what a computer is. Would be tough wouldnt it maybe they would just show us symbols. After all eistein himself thought that the brain interpeted information with symbols look into it.

  • CANADAIAN

    Exactly, I get to presume, you don't! Lol

  • http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/about/ Vlatko

    @InsanePorcupine,

    All those are beautiful analogies, but unsuitable for the argument you're trying to make ala "present a router to a dolphin".

    We are not a "dumb" species. We understand to a certain extent how the universe works from the biggest to the smallest. We developed a universal language (mathematics) that helps us in describing the nature around us in a precise and delicate way.

    We've sent machines in our solar system and beyond.

    Do you think we would be dolphins when the aliens show us their routers aka crop circles? Come on.

  • http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/about/ Vlatko

    Hahaha... LOL.

  • InsanePorcupine

    saw that here be dragons video and I can find lies and false assumptions there too. I'm not going to say this isnt a scam they did ask for money but that skeptic video was just as bad from the opposite angle. Keep an open mind and a closed wallet thats what i say

  • Guest

    are you one of the lucky? lol
    az

  • CANADAIAN

    Might I make a suggestion for the comment board. I would find it handy to have posts numbered. Instead of "in reply to vlatko", "in reply to post #123". When some one trolls way back to the start and replies to a post, I like to be able to quickly find it to read before responding. I presume it would be a convenience to others as well.

  • InsanePorcupine

    ya Im not a fan of the main guy and would also like to say the whole bookcase thing at the starts screams look at me I read a lot. Bet you he read like 5 of those books

  • dewflirt

    Laughing my socks off, if dolphins had thumbs..... Love it :)

  • InsanePorcupine

    I never said It was impossible but maybe the aliens which may or may not exist have decided to use different methods, and also Michio Kaku theoretical physicist agrees with what I said. He believes and me also that aliens communicating to us is like you stopping in the middle of the highway and trying to explain stuff to a colony of ants. Maybe they don't even use speech they telepathically talk to each other. I would also argue that if you have an iq of lets say 120 you would consider someone with an iq of 50 dumb well what if an alien has an iq of like 360 maybe he can't be bothered besides last time he tried we chucked spears at him. YOU DON"T KNOW.

    And I didnt say anything about about showing a dolphin a router that was a completely different comment on a completely different topic and the fact that you combined them shows to me that you have the "unsuitable arguement".

    100 years ago people called tesla crazy for things that are common place today. Like cell phones and particle weapons. He had a lot of trouble explaing things then. Go back a little further and explain electricity to a knight. or germs to an early doctor. Handwashing was shown to significantly reduce deaths during childbirth yet it took years for people to actually wash their hand and the microscope had to be invented first. just a couple hundred years ago.

    Now you come out and presume we are smart enough to actual understand the advanced ideas an alien could bring to us. I think we probably could understand but then again maybe not what makes you so damn sure, seriously what certaintanties could you possibly possess that I dont and about the crop circles saw the videos before you posted them and found them unconvincing. I'm sure there are many man made crop circles. I'm not debating that what I would debate is some of the more intracate and complex ones I have seen dont really seem like people could have made them under the circumstances. That is all though I dont presume aliens or people made them I simply don't know. You saying that people made them because the alternatives are unlikely is faulty reasoning. That is the equivalent of seeing a murder scene and just because you know that people usually kill other people it wasn't something else like maybe ball lightning. YOU DONT KNOW. That has been is and always will be my point, your certainty is what I don't like I'm not saying your wrong.

  • Pysmythe

    If you actually click the "in reply to vlatko " part, the comment it was in response to pops up.

  • InsanePorcupine

    i would also add to this idea keep the reply to but also add the number if at all possible. That would make it the best of both worlds anywho good chatting with you all. Later

  • InsanePorcupine

    good to know.

  • http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/about/ Vlatko

    @InsanePorcupine,

    You say "Michio Kaku theoretical physicist agrees with what I said...". Probably yes, but he will certainly not agree with you about the crop circles being made by aliens in a desperate attempt to communicate with us. You're using Michio's reasoning about how incomprehensible aliens might be and you're fitting that in the "crop circle argument". I think Michio wouldn't like that.

    You also say "And I didnt say anything about about showing a dolphin a router that was a completely different comment on a completely different topic..."

    Nope, it wasn't a different topic, nor a different comment. It was a conversation between us: "Try describing routers modems and other computer devices without those words we made to describe them to a species that has no idea what a computer is"

    "...saying that people made them because the alternatives are unlikely is faulty reasoning".

    No it is not. It is only logical. If you have 5 alternatives and 4 of them are very unlikely it is logically to assume that one of the alternatives is plausible.

    It is true that I can't assert with 100% certainty (no one does that, not even science) but the most plausible answer at this moment is that crop circles are man made.

  • CANADAIAN

    nice, didn't realize that. But most comments are a reply, so it would be quick and easy to track back as far as you want with numbered posts.

  • Pysmythe

    Yeah, I didn't realize that's what you were really getting at until after I posted, lol.
    It is a good idea.

  • rawbot

    @Teddy Mcd: Not all lasers are visible to our sight. In fact, the more powerful ones (the ones used in laser cutters and alike) are very often invisible (e.g. CO2 lasers) and often have another visible laser just for us to see where they are aiming.

    But who knows, maybe it's not lasers after all... It could be something so top secret we don't even know of.

    (I'm sorry for reposting this but it somehow wasn't shown as a reply to your comment, so you probably missed it.) Edit: I guess it still doesn't work :(

  • InsanePorcupine

    sure I never said That the man made option was not probable in fact I agreed with you and said your probabaly right, probably. And yes it is faulty to assume that just because something is unlikely that it didn't happen.

    Second I never said anythong about dolphins in the context of routers. read my comments again or something. I'm talking about trying to explain things to people with language but a limited language. Not dolphins which have next to no language that we know of. Dolphins were and still are very unrelated to the crop circle argument.

    Thrid I didn't say not once that aliens caused crop circles. I said it was a possibility because it is. You may think it's improbable but in an infinite universe it is possible. Michio kaku never said aliens made crop circles nor am I saying that he did. Sorry for the misunderstanding all he said was, that aliens would be so far ahead of us the equivalent would be an ant hill on the side of the highway to us. And I think Michio kaku would like that just fine.

    You say no one asserts things in science asserts things with 100% certainty is also a bit of a joke. Soooooo scientists don't think gravity pulls you towards mass now? They are not certain? Fire is hot..... not certain c'mon seriously lots of people do that and you would be justified in doing so for many many things. However crop circle like a murder is an investigation into something that people did not first hand witness. Perhaps I can get people to duplicate these objects doesn't prove we made them. See the difference between crop circles and say the fact that I think we can all agree that water turns to ice when cooled. Yes I think there are many certainties in science which is fine but there shouldnt be certainties in investigations with this little evidence, witnesses, a video or something then maybe. Simply put, You were'nt there you don't know so stop pre supposing what happened in all crop circle cases. Each one whether you like it or not is a different investigation and you can't know for sure.

    Also just a question, are you an atheist? Just thought I'd ask because as unlikely as I think a father figure in the sky is I don't deny it because we don't know. Officially I am agnostic and was just wondering what your standpoint on that was.

    Regards Insane porcupine

  • http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/about/ Vlatko

    @InsanePorcupine,

    I don't know, but it seems you're intentionally trying to import vagueness in this thread.

    Hmmm... let see:

    "...it is faulty to assume that just because something is unlikely that it didn't happen."

    OK so would you agree that Santa Clause lives on a North Pole and is delivering presents to 2 billion children, every Christmas Eve. Probably not, since that is very UNLIKELY. See... even you (the agnostic) will discard some improbable situations when is clear that they're utterly funny. I wonder why would you do that, and where is your border between improbability, probability and plausibility. So no, it is not faulty to assume that just because something is unlikely that it didn't happen, especially when other reasonable alternatives exist.

    "...I never said anythong about dolphins in the context of routers."

    Ahhh... are you so literal in everything? I quoted your exact statement in my last comment. What I previously did, I named all your analogies with one ironic name - "present a router to a dolphin." That's it.

    "...no one asserts things in science asserts things with 100% certainty is also a bit of a joke".

    No it isn't joke. In science, as in much of life, there are few absolutes. Science is a process; not an absolute. Scientific method is such to allow uncertainty. Only religion is 100% certain, science only on few occasions.

    "Perhaps I can get people to duplicate these objects doesn't prove we made them"

    No, but it throws a very founded doubt in the "alien stuff." Plus the fact that Bower and Chorley admitted that they've made more than 200 crop circles from 1978–1991 and claimed to be responsible for most if not all circles made prior to 1987. (You forgot to read my comment way below, with 7 points in it)

    "You were'nt there you don't know so stop pre supposing what happened in all crop circle cases"

    I was also not there when Inquisition ruled, but I know what happened. I also haven't been to Pluto, but I know how it orbits. These are lame examples but it really doesn't matter if I witnessed making of a crop circle or not.

    "...as unlikely as I think a father figure in the sky is I don't deny it because we don't know."

    Right, now tell me about Santa Clause, Snow White, Zeus and Thor. There are documents about them. Do they exist or not?

  • Guest

    click on "in reply to Vlatko" and it will make his post appear. Your idea is good though!
    az

  • InsanePorcupine

    So then atheist I take it? You did deflect my question. I really have no more to say on the subject than I already have so I'll leave my comments and is and people can think for themselves.

    The answer to your question about santa is that no. I have never believed in santa even when I was a kid my parents couldn't get me to believe that. I would agree there is a line of which you speak of between a reasonable doubt and and unreasonable one.

    And about zeus and thor For all I know that was the name of the aliens who ruled as gods in antiquity not saying I know It was thousands of years ago but hey they could have been real. As far as snow white and santa clause pretty sure they are made up they are much more recent although Kris Kringle existed but he dropped money down the chimney.

    Later, Insane Porcupine out.

  • emp12345

    I think we can't watch enough of these type of documentaries so we start to think about what we might do about this situation ourselves. Docu is however a bit woolly when they talk about free energy. Although I believe there is such a thing (since Tesla believed in it) the duco is vague about is and at first I stopped watching. Many topics in the docu have been adressed elsewhere as well, so not much news but they give some suggestions what we can do ourselves. Basically talk to people and organize is key.

  • InsanePorcupine

    that tripped me out my name is austin ;)

  • PickMyName

    1. I wrote: "Dude, you're ranting like a lunatic on meth." And then, if you read further, the next sentence says, "But you kinda have to..."

    To paraphrase: "You sound crazy, but that's necessary to speak the truth."
    Tell me -- how is that insulting to anyone other than a meth head? Oh, I'm sorry, Vlatko, did I strike a nerve?

    2. I apologize for commenting on posts I found interesting after watching the video. From now on, Vlatko, I'll only reply to posts in which I have no interest. 'Cause that would make sense. [Note to Vlatko: Sarcasm.]

    3. Remember the old days, when if you "Reply"-ed to a post, the reply would be right under the post? Now it doesn't even say who I'm replying to. But I'll go look....
    Clearly, I was being sarcastic, and I've found two posts on this page that it *might* have applied to, and I've got two pages to go, so, let me just say that this obviously sarcastic remark was to someone who was pretending that science hasn't gone beyond Newton. But that's pretty obvious, or so I thought. I'll try to dumb down my writing for you, Vlatko.

    Now, as to your question as to why this non-scientist didn't write a peer-reviewed paper, yes, both of us know the answer: He's not a scientist and doesn't even claim to be. Does that make him a charlatan? You know the answer: No. So why did he make the film? To get people thinking, something you seem to abhor, Vlatko.

    Nice to know that "BS" isn't an insult; I've a feeling that knowledge will come in handy rather soon. For instance, are you saying that Tesla wrote peer reviewed papers? Yes, you are. Please provide a link, Vlatko.

    4. You say, : "I thought the one who is making the claim has to prove beyond reasonable doubt that their claim is valid." Agreed. SOMEbody said crop circles are all fake. I'm asking for proof. Oh, I get it, Vlatko. Only people who disagree with *you* have to provide proof. My response to that, in the words of Vlatko: "BS".

    You say my argument is religious in nature? Vlatko, you're getting fuller and fuller. All it says is, : "Prove your statement."

    5. "Simply the idea that aliens are visiting this planet regularly and decided just to make crop circles is really laughable." So, laugh, that's your right. But for you to state that as fact is so arrogant as to make me not respect you as a thinking being. I thought this site was big enough for reasonable people to disagree without being insulted, but I see I'm wrong on that point.

    6. If you were to watch the video you put up, you would see that it's the video you put up that says "energy vortex". I was using the terms of the conversation at hand. Another Vlatko no-no?

    "Why would an alien do X or Y?" Because they choose to. But since you brought it up, tell me why they wouldn't. Honestly, do you actually find that to be a reasonable "argument"? Because I actually don't. But I bet if you asked any budding science-fiction writer, you could probably get fifteen answers if five minutes. Would that *prove* anything to you? No? Then why ask the question? Please, Vlatko, try to get some imagination. It is required for intelligent thought.

    7. Scientists obviously have a vested interest in the status quo. And that's the way it should be, more or less for the reasons you attempted to state.

    If you want to believe that the system works perfectly, go ahead. However, I believe that's laughable. And "cold fusion" is a really wonderful example of where it fails. Your frankly goofy assertion that technology has to work "first time -- every time" [my paraphrasing] is, of course, BS. Complete BS.
    If an expirementer can create excess tritium on her kitchen table three in ten times, then something is going on. A *true* scientist would say, "something is going on". Your ridiculous statement implies that if the first steam engine didn't work, then steam engines can't work. If the Wright brother's first airplane didn't work, powered flight is impossible. A truely stupid statement, Vlatko. Sorry for the "stupid" comment; I mean to say that you're full of BS.
    Did the Space Shuttle work 100% of the time? No? Does that mean the Space Shuttle *can't* work? According to Vlatko, yes.

    As for the slimy statement that "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence", I would love to hear your scientific, mathematical definition of "extraordinary". Or is that entire statement pure BS?

  • PickMyName

    So you believe that your reasoning skills are better than the astronauts who have been there and have access to info that you don't.
    Wow.

  • InsanePorcupine

    and thought i had long posts

  • PickMyName

    @Brennilthos64
    I'm not looking to persuade. When people pretend to *know*, I ask. Part of me thinks crop circles are made only by people; part of me thinks not. I keep an open mind and question everyone who claims to have answers. Shouldn't you? Why, yes, you seem to do just that.

    Here's a question: What name did you pick for me? As I read your post on this site, I see "Verbal Kint" [K I N T]. I don't know what that means...but, your post came to my email, and *there*, you call me "Verbal Kent" [K E N T]. I don't know what that means, either.
    But I *do* want you to know that your name for me differs, depending on if I'm looking at this site or looking at my email.

    Oh! I bet you're calling me "Verbal Kunt" [K U N T]! Is that it?
    Just to let everyone reading this know, what I read on this site and what comes into my inbox are two different things.

    To be clear, Bennilthos64, SOMEbody is messing with your words. What you type is not necessarily what we see. Creepy, huh? I'd be kinda cheesed, if I were you.

    And, yes, I'm rather proud that my psychology professor *did* call me his "gadfly"!

  • Pysmythe

    Are you aware of what the phrase "immune, either" means in the context of my comment?

    Astronauts ought to know better than the average person about such slimy things as "extraordinary claims" and Occam's Razor, and if by their own words they appear not to, then, absolutely, in that particular instance I'd say my reasoning skills are better than theirs, no problem.

    And let me just be very blunt about my faith regarding the ever-emerging religion of UFOs: While I have no doubt whatsoever about there being life elsewhere in the universe, and maybe even in our own solar system, I'm afraid it's too important an issue to be decided by anything short of a photo-op on the South Lawn.

  • Pysmythe

    Not at all! Verbal Kint was a character (played by Kevin Spacey), a brilliant storyteller, as it turns out, in the film 'The Usual Suspects'.

    edit- I was going to post something facetious here, but never mind.

  • http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/about/ Vlatko

    @PickMyName,

    1. You obviously have a different definition for an INSULT aka "ad hominem." Having said that it is going to be futile to point out to you all the insults in your comment.

    2. I was ONLY reacting to your comment since you went on a rampage to prove everyone wrong.

    3. So why did he make the film? To get people thinking.... It is remarkable how people reason. He spent 8$ mil on a documentary, instead of pushing his claims where they belong. He doesn't have to be scientist. Or some REAL scientist could have done it for him.

    Are you looking for the Tesla peer-review papers. Funny, you don't know he was mainly inventor, or you pretend. You should be looking for patents mate. There are gazilion of them. He was not making adverts.

    4. Here are two simple examples for ya:

    I say I invent perpetuum mobile. Many claim it is right, many don't believe.

    Crop-circle appears. Many claim that is made by aliens, many don't believe.

    The onus is on you, I mean people who claim this. Don't pretend you don't know it. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. And extraordinary means unusual, in this case wild speculation.

    Simple mate.

    5. The idea that aliens are visiting this planet regularly and decided just to make crop circles is really laughable indeed. And that is not an insult directed to you. It means if you say this in any scientific circle people will simply laugh, not literally, but they will face-palm or roll their eyes at least.

    6. Why would an alien do X or Y?" Because they choose to. Is that it. Is that your answer? Anyhow, they wouldn't because it is highly unlikely that happening given all the facts we know about crop circles so far. Read all my comments.

    7. Scientists obviously have a vested interest in the status quo I'm sorry but I have to say this: That is the most ignorant statement I have ever read. I was not implying that. Tell me, you follow scientific journals, peer-review documents and so on, or you just feed on YouTube clips and random websites on Internet? Anyhow if the science is status quo how come they've challenged Einstein last year. Hint: neutrinos.

    And yes, if you're going to provide an experiment in your kitchen, you have to show to the scientific community that is 100% testable, verifiable, repeatable.

  • yourfacealreadyexists

    Would love to one day be able to scroll down to the comments and read valid reviews of doco's before watching them and not have to read keyboard heroes personal insult's being thrown back and forth. Just saying...

  • Teddy Mcd

    @ yourfacealreadyexists

    "Keyboard Heroes" - now there is a clever word combo. I'll use it.

    Point tho' - If you want a valid review of a doc I suggest always start with the earliest comments - before the ruckus fires up.

    And - I often check around google world and wiki land to get reviews and comments of a doc before I decide whether to watch it or let it slide. (Can't watch 'em all.)

    Besides, half the fun of this site is the comments.

  • InsanePorcupine

    it may be to late but this documentary was interesting and thought provoking as you can tell by the lively debates. At the same time though the main dude clearly has some agenda that does not include helping the world but is based on $ signs. It was still an ok watch some of it was right some of it was questionable. I would give it a 5.5 out of 10

  • PickMyName

    @Brennilthos64
    Cool! I was afraid you were being sexist. Still, I wonder why it was altered in my email....

  • Pysmythe

    Well, because I edited it... I spelled it Kent at first, which was incorrect when I checked it. I'm big on editing. Although I'm male, I've got a little Jackie Onassis in me... Also, there is apparently a hip-hop artist named Verbal Kent, and I didn't want you to think I was referring to him.

  • PickMyName

    @Brennilthos64
    Ok, I get it now. It was the first, unedited, version that came to my inbox. Thank you for not comparing me with a hip-hop artist! I'm old-fashioned; I like music played on musical instruments. Crazy, I know.

    Thelonious Monk for President 2012! He's not dead, he's just way out there!

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_QFGBOKJDLPXLXA2F7CGJSMQE4U js

    I enjoyed this film. It gives people who think like me a reason to get involved in what is going on in our system that most do not know about. It lays out some tin hat theories that are most likely true in my opinion. The foremost being the 911 false flag. I am highly skeptical of the crop circles but this film makes a good point with comparing the designs to the energy field. This movie will explain how things like our banking system,energy,medical and food production may not in the best interest of the people.

  • Atheist14

    This guy is such a crackpot

  • MickFraser

    With many similar docs and books being focused on the scams from fractional banking to aliens....and most agreeing, they should work together, because some of it's true and should be fixed..but then again, some is just plain crazy.

  • Maybemaya

    our current idea of "science" is related to the accurately describe a phenomenon that is again perceived by the consciousness forming a perspective- supported by "philosophy"(which one can conceptualize in whatever way). It is not debated that we probably know just a little bit... which is indicated in our process of knowing-unknowing, establishing, debating, agreeing disagreeing etc etc...all are an instance and clash of perspectives, thoughts, ideas..and finally "A man who knows something knows that he knows nothing at all."- Socrates. What we need to realize is the knowledge of self, which inevitably is the source of what we see, hear, touch, think, smell, taste....as sentient beings first. Therefore our knowledge is almost entirely based on these little slits in the tower. But it is the conscious mind that processes this "knowledge".Energy Vortexes could also be the idea of an "essential mind" which is separate from our senses... That is what makes everything spin, patterns form, shapes emerge, concepts, but existing in every dimension in visibly different forms... spinning still. I guess my point here is, to realize the source of energy is to follow what really exists right now, and not in our minds as constructs, visuals, interaction and a completely different idea of technology implies. Nothing is constant in any scale right? And the tools for doing so would require a certain degree of "sacrifice" ( I guess we have to visualize a system without money and where we can actually be satisfied without a lot of things we associate ourselves with, but essentially can do without). I am sorry if I wasnt able to articulate a perspective that I enjoy, I am not a native speaker.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Mercenarry-ForHire/100000621480223 Mercenarry ForHire

    Theres not enough Money to spread resources around to everyone, so no wonder theres a lot of problems with our society. (There are problems with our system but no one knows for sure what really works, Freedom or Restrained-Freedom.)

    Most solutions ask too much of people. Be charitable , stand up for others , dont judge others, think on your own , use your time to be productive , be happy , dont sink to others level.

    Humans are so different when you look at the Individual, strengths and weaknesses.

    No one thing works for everyone so we must have multiple things going on at the same time, when that occurs goals conflict and conflict is born from that.

    No wonder people are taught to only see something and not to question others.

  • Maybemaya

    we are essentially identical but conceptually distinct

  • AntiTheist666

    Thrive??? You’ve got to be kidding me. Perish is more likely.

    If you like your docs with science based reasoning then you won’t like this. On the other hand if you like pseudo science, fairy tales and cheese, this is right up your street. The presenter is perhaps the most insincere man on the planet!

    The Crucified One

  • http://twitter.com/Fjordscene Evan Llewellyn

    I kind of lost interest when they started talking about aliens teaching ancient civilisations... sigh.

  • fellowhumans

    The greatest enemy of knowlegde is not ignorance... it is the illusion of knowledge.
    If you watch this to the end without any judgement, it could be one of the most important and eye-opening documentary that could wake us up from our illusion.
    We need to unite and get over our distance and differences, that have given the Elite/the world government good reason to enslave us and bring the world in to this misrable point.

  • Guest

    So you mean you think there are no other living organisms except for on earth? You are ignorant and arrogant, dear ma'm. Please see the whole documentary, or i will cry to my tears when i go to bed today.

  • Guest

    Computers are also musical instruments, fyi..

  • Guest

    Foster Gamble seems to me like a similar visionary as Tesla. Just because Tesla is deceased, does that makes him a more reliable source? No, it does not..

  • emp12345

    you must be kidding. You know who Tesla is and what he has done?

  • Knabozny

    FINALLY! THE VOICE OF LOGIC AND REASON! thank you for posting this, especially the line about how people were persecuted because they tried to show the world that the earth was NOT flat.

    When I read some of the purposeless bickering comments on here about this film, and how it is just propaganda I have to wonder. If this really was all made up, what is so wrong about it? What is so wrong with trying to live in a healthier and more morally just society? Are these people really that blind to think that some of our "leaders" don't take advantage of us?! To think that the country and world we live in today is what is best for all of the people?

    Alright...I must stop there before I really go off on some of these idiots!

    I'm not saying everything they promote in this film is correct or possible, but who really thinks what you see on FOXnews is always accurate and correct?!

  • Knabozny

    great reply!! This is my thought too. Are they made by aliens?? I have no idea. Who knows, maybe it is a way for testing new technology. Maybe it is a message that we just don't understand. But, I certainly know, they were NOT made by a bunch of people walking around with boards. I know understand how people could still be so blind as to not see that it just isn't possible to get that type of precision!

    Sigh...don't worry my friend, at least you aren't the only one who feels this way!

  • Knabozny

    thank you for actually getting the point of this movie, not proving that there are aliens lol

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_GP3R54P5TELXUW3YVATEKYBDWE Perry

    "If this really was all made up, what is so wrong about it? What is so wrong with trying to live in a healthier and more morally just society?"

    Are you ignorant of the inherent contradiction in that statement? A morally just society built on a foundation of lies by definition cannot be a morally just society.

    "I'm not saying everything they promote in this film is correct or possible, but who really thinks what you see on FOXnews is always accurate and correct?!"

    You're trying to have it both ways. On the one hand you're saying that other media such as Fox are inaccurate and you're offering that as a criticism...on the other you're using the fact that they are doing something wrong to justify what the makers of Thrive do? You're saying it's okay to lie and misinform viewers as long as you have good intentions? Do you not see what is so fundamentally wrong about that?

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_GP3R54P5TELXUW3YVATEKYBDWE Perry

    If you think the ideas put forward in this documentary will lead to unity, you are dangerously naive.

    This would lead to a world in which the rich control even more of the wealth. The ideas put forward in this 'documentary' were first put forward by Ayn Rand, except back then, she was honest about what it was -- the virtue of selfishness. You think it's a coincidence that the heir of Proctor & Gamble is advocating for lower taxes on the wealthy?

  • CrashLandis

    why do you hate so much? all you got out of that film was a negative response. and now you wish to spread that negativity... what is your objective? to put down the people who simply wish to promote strength and unity within ourselves? step outside the box that's been created for you, and start to love. i feel sorry for you, if i was a religious man, i would pray for you. why even watch this film if you already have your mind made up? the fact that you can't see the good in this film, shows that you already "know" that we as a society are too late for a change. that or you don't want a change. either way, being the realist that you are, must make you a very lonely man.

  • Lisa Hijar

    What's Not true about this video CrashLandis? I've done my research and yes the people and me included were lied to and have had our money stolen all the years I've worked to give my money away to a Privately owned bank; illegal to be in business. Do some homework!

  • oceanrats

    WOW! This was absolutely fantastic. You could go for hours watching depressing documentaries on what we all know is happening. This one is different. It is inspiring and a call to action. The post about the debunking of this film I can understand.... Of course "they" would want this suppressed. If I was a paid shill I would do the same..haha

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/John-Gros/1267365077 John Gros

    The world rests on the shoulders of a giant torus! LOL

  • abdulwalee

    Those before you used to give to their worldly affairs what was left over from their pursuit of the hereafter. But today, you give to the matters of the hereafter the left-overs from your pursuit of worldly affairs.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=784885563 Chris Makin

    OK, this just comes across as mental after 6 minutes.

  • Mediaskop

    good doc!
    funny to read some of the comments in here after watching this, there are actually ppl so indoctrinated from school/media they can't even get the message. the elites soldiers are everywhere, sad thing for them the awakening of the ppl are spreading fast thru great docs like this one. seen so many poor docs on the subject but this stands out along zeitgeist etc.

    thanks TDF

  • Kateye70

    Lol. Lost me at crop circles...

  • lovesdocs

    this documentary was interesting. I like the variety of people that were represented and it was fun to watch too. I like the message but, to me, the premise that we are meant to "thrive" by evolution, I guess just seems to be a really big assumption. I would like to thrive of course but, to say it's an evolutionary mandate doesn't seem to jive with people who have disabilities and various other reasons for not thriving. Also, having watched a few documentaries about crop circles, I have to go with the skeptics that those are man made. Although, I don't know how we can explain the more intricate ones without the consent of the person who owns the farms. and, the electro magnetized fields is pretty strange as an after effect. But, I agree in general with everything else that he brings up and he had the decency to try and offer some solutions.

  • http://www.facebook.com/ElmoPutz David Foster

    Those that thrive find a niche. Those that don't...

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/QI3MIQKWBCROZVKHQ4XOOO5SVA Michael Elvin

    We thrive only til we hit our limits. Then we die.

    Also, it takes a leap of faith to jump from the major structures in our universe tending to swirl in a toroidal shape, which makes a lot of sense, to crop circles and Chariots of the Gods. Which don't.

    But it was fun anyway. Let's hope Grey Goo never figures out a way to thrive.

  • Betty Phillips

    This guy does not have a very trustworthy facial expression.

    I skipped through it, but it looks like he is trying to say monetary inflation causes my Torus to whither like a rotten apple. Well, my Torus is made by Ford and it's insured so I have nothing to worry about.

  • http://www.facebook.com/james.lile James Lile

    This guy isn't a used car salesman. You are part of problem, God help you...

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=644245806 Michael Sullivan

    The intricate ones are indeed mysterious. They are inexplicable. We don't know what kind of tools were used to make them. There were no traces of people coming or going. The electromagnetism, etc. Some of them, I can believe were made by people just for fun, but you can easily see the difference between the ones we know were made by man and the other ones that are flawless, trace free, and intricate. I still believe that the possibility exists for there to be an alternative explanation.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Terry-Beaton/100000940529089 Terry Beaton

    This doc starts out New Agey and ends up darkly conspiratorial. The first part was airy fairy (idealistic) and the second, deeply foreboding (cynical). I think the truth is hovering around in the middle somewhere.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1782831919 Lito Magnanimous

    I think you're talking about your clittorus?

  • Keith Armstong

    This is worth watching. We are each responsible for the future of this world and this planet. If we allow governments more power, they will willingly use it against us. Conformity is unnecessary, intelligence an abolute necessity.

    Take action to protect your freedom or lose it, that is the basic problem we face daily. This documentary is not fictional, not some unfounded conspiracy, but look what's happening around you. The truth is staring you in the face... control of money, control of food production, control of people.

    We've got to take our power back. Simply don't participate with any organization which does harm.

  • http://www.facebook.com/amooreminott Alex Moore-Minott

    although its not important, I can tell he is a classical guitarist...ok I'm done

  • http://1iotofoto.wix.com/otofoto oQ

    The invisible man you are, no name, no pic, just a breath of an opinion.
    I agree, it appears being a trained musician comes with many rippled effects. It would enhance one's higher sense for sure.
    1i

  • CrayRail

    A couple points right away. This is extremely overproduced and doesn't criticize the profit system. The guy who made it is a 1%er who would like to show us what a great guy he's been. There are no invisible worlds just the one we have to deal with. Invisible reality will not "save" us. Practical and consistent political organizing for change *will.* Just as it helped those who lived through - and fought the system that created - The Great Depression. So if this guy really wanted to do something to make change he would start funding grassroots efforts for real change, not airy fairy "energy" videos. "Don't mourn - Organize." - IWW songwriter Joe Hill

  • brianrose87

    Well he could do worse things to reaffirm what a great guy he is. right? Most people (in the U.S. at least) just buy a new phone, or buy a girl a drink to reaffirm their greatness.

    If this guy felt compelled to make this doc due to ego issues, then so be it.

    Its better than if he said "I want to show people how great I am, so I'm going to buy a new dining room table set".

  • CrayRail

    At 15:16 - "Given that so much suffering in our world is a result of lack of access to energy..." (inset shows a poor naked child crouching on a Third World street...) So I bring this up because "lack of energy" is not the cause of the suffering of the people of the world. It's called exploitation of human labor and natural resources for the sole purpose of making a profit and reinvesting those profits in order to get....more profit. If we are going to change anything we need to realize this basic truth about the US as a global empire intent on maintaining this system at all costs.

  • CrayRail

    You make a good point I was sort of shooting from the hip there, but what I'm getting at is that, in general, wealthy people do this and point away from criticizing the very system that allows them to maintain and control wealth....and I haven't even gotten to the anti-Semitic part of the film yet. Still watching...and posting.

  • brianrose87

    Anyone who has worked for their money, regardless of if they worked a little to get a lot, is generally going to support the system that gave them that. In fact the ones who don't work at all, and yet still get it all, are even MORE likely to support the system, as sad as that is.

    If anything, the guy who works even less to get even more will then support the system even more because their distorted reality will say "This system makes making money easy" without realizing they're receiving a disproportionate portion of a finite pie.

    Your point about energy is important. They do lack access to energy, but that's a symptom of a larger problem. The problem is that they lack control over their indigenous resources.

  • CrayRail

    That's funny about "working for their money" because most wealthy people inherited from long dead rich guys. But I think we will agree that poor people lack control over their resources and they lack access to food, clothing, shelter, decent education and adequate medical care. Most slaves didn't know they were slaves because it was against the law to teach them to read. Nowadays we simply pump them full of nonsense about mystical cubes, crop circles and those pesky Jews. Gawd I'm only a half hour through this and they are talking to people who think they've been aboard alien spacecraft. This **** is seriously out to lunch. Basically we need social change and the only way to do that is through something called "social revolution" or sometimes "sociliast revolution" if you aren't afraid of that word!

  • brianrose87

    In just the first 5 minutes of this documentary you can tell there's no genuine knowledge of ecological and biological principles, although it certainly wants to convince you.

    Saying that live naturally thrives ignores the antelope that just got stocked by, chased, and consumed by a lion. The infant whale that was just drowned to death by an Orca (so the Orca can survive), or the snake that just ate a Robbin's baby eggs. Every being "thrives" at the cost of another live, except plants, of course.

    We produce enough food to feed the world, especially if meat consumption wasn't so conspicuously high in the first world. This, however, ignores the long-term fact that Thomas Malthus laid out in the 1790's.

    Populations of any and every creature expand so long as their food sources expand. Food production cannot increase infinitely, and thus human population will, at some junction, follow suit.

    Homo sapiens is well beyond the long term carrying capacity of their surrounding environment to support them. For now we draw down our resources of fresh water, top soil, fossil fuels, phosphorous, etc. to maintain a population of 7 billion.

  • brianrose87

    Haha did anyone notice David Icke at 6:57?

    That says a lot that he was an influence...

    Lost me at Reptilian Aliens...

  • Ruizjavier

    I disagree with your last paragraph. I beleive that the correct perception would be to say that Homo Sapien's GREED is well beyond the long term carrying capacity of their surrounding environment to support them. There is plenty of room and plenty of food on the planet. But not all have money to buy it.

  • brianrose87

    Well said.

  • http://twitter.com/BzzKynd Michelle

    I may have given more consideration to your post, had it not been full of misspellings/typos. Sorry, you lost me mid-way through the second paragraph.

  • Lovro Šari? Kora?evi?

    Your arguments clearly show that you don't understand the concept of this film well enough to discuss it. For a start, you should think of the term "thrive" in the numbers of species not in the fact that they live dependent one of another and btw plants grow on leftovers from... Everything so I wouldn't really call them "independent".

    I guess your idea of thriving includes all life forms sorted on a bench smiling in a perfect, never ending summer day. Kind of boring eh?

  • RikG01

    I'd say Brian got the concept of the film but rejected it, as anyone who can keep their critical thinking intact, will do.

    Thrive is nothing more than an attempt by members of a wealthy, inheritance family, to appeal to well-meaning and/or spritual among us, then con them into voting for the very things that the well-meaning reject. Like giving the rich tax-breaks.

    It's a detestable piece of garbage that should be spurned and mocked by anoyone who wants the injustice' of the world to end. If the rich were at war with everyone else, then thrive would be their propaganda play to con some recruits or sympathisers.

    The link by Alex Milne is a very intereting piece, detailing why many of the contributers to this film have a signed a letter of dissociation from it. Even the people who were in it, think it is nonsense.

  • seppe.roekens

    I agree with alot of this documentairie's insights. The only thing that is bothering me is that the guy who tells the "story" first overwhelms us with fear and that we have to search for our own freedom and to release ourselfs from our corrupt governement, and how bad money really is and that we don't need it in our society, etc, wich I completely agree with. but than he starts to slowly presenting his solution, and forcing us to visit his website, where he offers training programs to become more seperated from this society in a way that we get our freedom back. And this is where I stopped watching, i visited his website where he offers these training programs and asking money for it... Isn't this wat he just told us NOT to do? I don't get it and therefore he is a genius. he makes a good documentairy and tries to get money out of us by doing that.

  • http://www.jdizm.com/ JDIZM

    This was truly eye opening...

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/TSUUPLVLJVGIO7SEG6H6H74UHY Mark

    I was told about this simular happenings 25 years ago,and it has and still is evolving,the pace is picking up,it"s true

  • http://www.facebook.com/peter.vanzeeland.7 Peter Van Zeeland

    I have seen an alien space ship leave our planet. Took about 5 minutes, straight up out of our atmosphere. So, if I can see an alien space ship, who's ta say that these people are really out to lunch ,or that, maybe, you are.

  • http://www.facebook.com/citizenkeane2.0 Kevin Keane II

    Absolulety PHENOMENAL! I was put off by the trailer and the first half hour of this as I thought it looked too preachey and as if it had a commercial agenda/movement. But after the first half hour and for the remainder of this doco, i was blown away. PLEASE EVERYONE SEE THIS

  • duguayp79

    I agree that more people are aware of the agenda, and those involved. However, I do not believe people are actually doing anything about it. Most of us are wage slaves. The only ones you find openly protesting are either unemployed, or independently wealthy, The rest of us have too many of these outlined "controls" ruling our activities to actually do more than not buy a coca-cola.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Zeropax-Ovo-Ono/100002265903340 Zeropax Ovo Ono

    New age propaganda; same luciferian doctrine but for the mass

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Zeropax-Ovo-Ono/100002265903340 Zeropax Ovo Ono

    ;

  • http://www.facebook.com/greg.wilton.10 Greg Wilton

    Zeropax Ovo Ono has absolutley no capacity to understand an extremely ,thourough doc , so well put together !!! He should stick to cartoons that he can relate to !

  • http://www.facebook.com/greg.wilton.10 Greg Wilton

    Best doc Ive seen "EVER "!!! This level of documented excellance can only be achieved by , "TRUE " human !!!
    I have experianced a full spectrum of emotions , from utter sadness to incomprehencable rage !
    Encourage everyone you know to watch this documentary !!!

    "We are all just unknowingly sheep in a handful of sheaperds' pastures "

  • http://profiles.google.com/elitescripts2000 Matt Kukowski

    Yes I agree... this kind of stuff fuddles up 'our plans'. :)

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Mic-Medeiros/1110692553 Mic Medeiros

    Over The Edge Nice comment, when I first watched this documentary I asked myself how could a multitude of high level officials say that aliens are here, I would still like to get that answer. Also absence of evidence isn't evidence so aliens could be here. I'm not disagreeing with you and I dislike people who make things up that are not true but I'm not willing to rule out aliens however the energy field they talk about in this film seems kind of weird. Good Luck

  • edwinmayor

    You're all completely missing the point.. whether aliens exist or not, are you trying to say we dont have the problems described in this video? Is that far fetched to your conditioned minds that evil men could be willing to destroy our planet, and suppress new technologies in the name of profit? I'd assume you're all disinformation agents if not for the fact that you all legitimately sound ignorant.

  • edwinmayor

    Oh, and for you disbelievers out there. People on fricken youtube are creating their own free energy devices. Derp..

  • Lovro Šari? Kora?evi?

    Agreed, but Brian is still a brainwashed greeny attacking this with bad arguments he got from another kind of a same goal propaganda.
    Glad to see there are some awake people though ;)

    (sorry Brian)

  • http://www.facebook.com/coryphee07 Jake Colvin

    sometimes it is best to just take what you will from info and focus little on what might hold you to disregard all that is provided. It seems though that that your questions of skeptic curiosity may be the key to lead you to do some more detailed research.

  • http://twitter.com/blondegirl214 blonde girl

    I love this doc <3

  • flopy disk

    liked the documentary...have always believed these things go on ...
    but cut your nails man !

  • Chaca

    The elite is making a big mistake and that is that they are putting the fate of the entire human race in the hands of their future generations, who they don't even know how they will be mentally. Sons of kings killed their own parents many times in the past to become the new king just to get power. Even when you have all the power in the world, you still will compete with those who want it and that will happen even in their elite group. The Morgans, Rockefeller, Rothchild families might be together pulling the strings, but eventually they will challenge and destroy each other because that is that history has taught us and the entire human race will vanish with them just because of their stupidity and I am sure they know it.

    I am sorry for saying this, but the human race has been contaminated with all kind of crazy ideas created by what the elite has done to this world. Sorry to say, but the only way to start doing the right thing in this planet as the guy in the video mentions will only be possible after the massive killing. A huge number of the people in the population won't change no matter what. Religious fanatics, drug addicts, mentally unstable people among others will never accept any type of change that contradicts what they think even if you put them in a "happy society"

    Don't be sad, the elite is doing all the work to "unify" the world and the human race in general. However, at the end, they will screw up because that is what history has taught us. The good thing about what they doing/will do is that they will have put all the tools in place for a new better global society to take over to implement a better system with better technology, better laws and just care about the safety of other and the evolution of the human race in general.

  • adam

    Chaca I agree with you and see the man who got this new way, his name is Jacque Fresco.

  • Chris Nichols

    By watching these types of films it really opens your eyes to the lies and falseness we are being told by our financial and political leaders. To me they are now purely transparent. Our greatest weapon is awareness. Like and spread this video all around facebook, twitter and such social outlets. We must spread the word.

  • richardwicks

    Holy moley. Has NOBODY here passed a freaking science class? You think this stupid load of crap is "opening your eyes"? Pass a physics 101 course and some basic calculus.

    Perpetual energy machines?
    Aliens communicating to humanity through crop circles?
    A torus being the key to unlimited energy?

    Scientology is more believable than this bunk.

  • Dhe Art

    i agree with you for as what we practiced "change would start within ourselves"

  • Janeen Clark

    open source RBE alternative to tvp and tzm is coming soon where individuals can join and work in their fields in a cooperative way bridging the transition to a rbe

  • DumontCo Concierge

    Would you be kind enough to elaborate on your criticism?

    Just your explanation on crop circles would be enough. Who is patting down vegetation in the form of sacred geometry?

  • 11BenJamin11

    You never know it could all be true. And you richardwicks could be the stupid load of crap.

  • Pry

    Ugh, I hate how this guy thinks we "have a purpose" and that "life's natural function is to THRIVE." I guess he's unaware that the vast majority of all species that ever lived are extinct.

  • PedroFromPortugal

    To Pry:
    "I guess he's unaware that the vast majority of all species that ever lived are extinct" ???
    What, are you referring to the thousands of species extincted in the last two centuries by the direct action of our own species?
    And if our purpose is not to let life thrive and thrive along with it, than what is it? To be a plastic soul like you seem to be?

  • PedroFromPortugal

    And you? Did you?
    Did you heard about Nikola Tesla on your freaking science class?
    A advise you to watch and see a few more peaces of information compiling dozens of others talking about alternatives and you will UNDERSTAND how all these alternatives tend to be ridicularized by science classes experts like you, particularly in these so progressive and friendly industrial era of the last few decades.

  • Saretta

    How wonderful that all these great ideas are coming forth for positive change! And yes, each of us does have a purpose. It takes thought to discover what it is. To feel self- hatred is not new but has an historical basis. You must discover this for yourself. Life is not about eating hamburgers. But for some life IS about eating hamburgers.

  • Richard

    "Airy fairy" alien mumbo jumbo, conspiracy, conspiratorial? Are the people, including US military brass, not credible sources for things they have "witnessed"? I guess all credibility remains in tact when they are manufacturing evidence to invade foreign countries, but the second they start talking about documented first hand encounters with outer space beings they became s*upid conspiracy theorists. I'm not claiming this info to be true, but if you present an argument, then back it up with researched evidence, I'm going to give you the time of day. I'm a rational, critical human being. If 100 years ago you came to me and said,"dude, we can put people on the moon", I would have slapped you. If you came to me with info on how it can be done, I'd slap myself for judging that man too quickly. To those of you who attack people with ad hominems, you are only appealing to people's emotions, and not providing logical counter arguments. What I am seeing is a guy who created a documentary, not with emotional arguments, but researched arguments, versus people just insulting the guy with names. Stop it. No. Now, I challenge you to question your belief system, and open yourself up to a realm of possibilities which run counter to your current beliefs. After all, we humans once believed the world was flat.

  • pawl mattie

    man, all you guys are really whopping out some bulletproof arguments

  • bluetortilla

    I second that!

  • bluetortilla

    BE VERY AFRAID!
    Oh come on folks- this self-serving doc. is a load of junkola piled on junkola. Every single thing in it has been hashed out and debunked already ad nauseum. Mr. Gamble (you know- of 'Proctor and Gamble,' I doubt he's a black sheep) is blatantly promoting New World Order liberalism (read: the unbridled freedom to exploit whoever is gullible enough to be exploited; no safeguards; no government funding; no taxes; and most importantly of all no regulation). No child labor laws for crying out loud. This guy is a tooty fruity Pseudo New Agey Cultist who uses obvious Scientology tactics to lure you in. A wolf in sheep's clothes.
    Having access to millions of dollars to produce your own doc. gives you great advantages. You can buy big names, edit. and make sure all these professional people agree with you. The downside is the obvious lack of credibility since no one disagrees with him. But if you dear reader want to see for yourself, just start by Wiki'ing all the pseudoscience in this propaganda piece. Shameless.
    However, I have no idea what agenda he has. Is he just a nut? Wanna be Messiah, delusions of grandeur and megalomania? As heir to Procter and Gamble, he has plenty of money to carry out a strong Libertarian agenda, but I suppose that's too boring. Maybe he's just eccentric.
    I like what Carl Sagan said about extraterrestrial life. To paraphrase: Some people are blinded in their belief of extraterrestrial visitors because of their passionate desire for it to be true while others are likewise blinded in stubborn denial out of their fear that they will be hostile; both extremes view the possibility erroneously. I have an open mind. For all I know intelligent other-world life is here on earth. Believe me, I would be just as elated as anyone else at a first encounter. But I've studied UFO sightings again again and so far have discovered nothing (at best) conclusive, and 95% percent of it can be debunked outright.
    Likewise, crop circles have been replicated by humans, by several methods, and many crop circle artists (unfortunately vandals as well as the process does in fact damage the crops) have admitted to the activity. I do appreciate the beauty (though not the lawlessness) of crop circles, but it is the consensus that crop circles are manmade.
    I won't even comment on free energy.
    Finally, I found the repeated video clip of the starving toddler sickening and just plain evil. I haven't seen such a callous device of persuasion in a long time.
    What does Mr. Gamble want from me? That's what I'd like to know. He makes himself out to be an enemy of control and oppression and a champion of freedom. Pure BS. I consider myself firmly in both the anarchist and pacifist squares of political philosophy and I don't see that any of my ideas agree with his. I am for reform, and ironically, far more regulation than we have now (as an anarchist it's the industrialists like P&G who are the first line enemies and that the government's role is to protect the people, not the industrialists. But you won't hear Mr. Gamble talk of this at all- it sounds to me like he wants a return to an 1800's style laisezze-faire. Before government's role can become less and less necessary through redundancy, we need a harmonious society. And to achieve a harmonious global society, we need a guarantee of certain fundamental human rights. The process towards this is huge beyond description and may take centuries. Does Gamble talk about protecting human rights? No. If we just have this 'free energy' device, all will be great I suppose. Actually, I think readers here can appreciate the mayhem and chaos that would ensue if suddenly everyone in the world had access to as much energy they wanted. Nature doesn't work that way- gaining alternative forms of energy for the world is going to be a very hard won battle. I have faith that we'll prevail. I don't have faith in magic.
    Mr. Gamble is a nincompoop. A dangerous one.

  • bluetortilla

    Of course in the interests of the oil industry alternative fuel is being suppressed but zero-point energy is just pure fiction, both practically and theoretically. Now, in the future who knows what energy sources we'll find, but sorry- today there is no such zero-point device.
    In fact, if there were free energy like that, Rockefeller or no Rockefeller, you could not keep the dam from busting. Guaranteed.
    Solar panels are getting better and better. Hear about that?

  • bluetortilla

    This forum is 'adults only' Ben.

  • bluetortilla

    I suggest Wikipedia as a great place to start. But hey! Maybe they're in on the conspiracy too!
    In which case WHO can we trust? Mr. Gamble? Oh boy, now we're really in trouble.

  • bluetortilla

    I agree. And this doc. panders to those good sentiments. But it's also an indoctrinating piece of frighto. Too bad.

  • 11BenJamiin11

    Yes I know this forum is for adults only. Its too bad there are so many brainwashed/ close minded/ brain-dead adults here on earth. Its annoying to see that people would rather see the world go to sh*t, than to take a look at actual possibilities that are available for to manifest to create a more fair, safe, healthy and prosperous world for everyone. Its too bad that a lot of people don't realise how bad they suck. Oh well.

  • bluetortilla

    I appreciate that too Ben. But perhaps the 'dissenters' of this film aren't brainwashed so much as they see Mr. Gamble's approach as cultish and brainwashing. I would say his political approach is 'savage.' And we just don't buy the pseudoscience.
    Do I want to help change the world? Hell yes I do! :D

  • bluetortilla

    I would say that Mr. Gamble is evidently one smooth operator.

  • jaberwokky

    I was drawn to watch this one because of the recent spate of comments (bluetortilla) coupled with a current preoccupation for some deeper understanding of consciousness. The latter reason is why I keep watching this type of doc no doubt, there's a certain allure to the elusive phenomenon.

    Generally it's a well produced, well financed effort that does a fair job of asserting its trance like hold on the mind. It's also as cheesy as a Kiss album but I'm cool with a bit of cheese every so often.

    Content wise this doc is a doozy that's dangerously wrong on so many things. Mr Gamble seems to be shooting for a record on how many emotive fringe theories can be crammed into one sitting. I can't make out if he's being deliberately misleading or if he is genuinely as gullible as this doc would make it seem. Perhaps it's both.

    Amongst the generous plethora of 'WTF' on offer here Mr Gamble was kind enough to include a life time supply of my pet peeve, free energy. Seeing as recently I've been entertaining the idea that it's near impossible to reason a person out of a belief that they never reasoned themselves into in the first place I'll avoid the physics 101 stuff. Instead, some credibility issues to consider.

    The Adam Trobly/David Farnsworth free energy device FBI raid : They don't tell you that the raid was initiated at the behest of an investor that was finding no satisfaction with regards to business returns.

    John Hutchison floating matter phenomenon : They don't tell you that Mr Hutchison is a documented fraud who's shenanigans were captured on video. Levitating UFOs with strings attached.

    David Icke: They don't tell you that he's the lizard king and he can do anything.

    Suffice to say that there is an abundance of sound rebuttal material for almost every claim made here if anybody honestly wants to know the truth in any of this and can take a moment and step away from feelings of government/corporate generated paranoia for long enough. I don't trust them any more than any one else but there comes a point where you have to wonder if your distrust of one party is not just leading you into the arms of another, more soothing, liar. If that sounds like an analogy to relationships then you might see what I mean.

    Overall this was all rather disappointing as I learned nothing new, which is why I felt compelled to write such a long winded post. I see a pattern in that the consciousness movement keeps getting lumped together with some of the more extreme flights of fancy, which is a shame. The phrase 'smeared by association' comes to mind.

    Maybe I'm still looking in the wrong places for answers. Maybe I've been spoilt and I expect too much from documentaries. Maybe David Icke really is the lizard king. One thing's for certain (or is it?), I expected more of a Princeton educated 'master of the world' when it comes to immunizing oneself from stupidity.

    Peace.

  • richardwicks

    Really?

    Deliver one to me, and I will pay you $100,000 cash, no questions asked. You pay for the flight to Silicon Valley though. I'm not giving you a free vacation for something that doesn't work.

  • bluetortilla

    The critically-minded people here aren't arguing that the problems of rampant corruption and mass destruction don't exist. We are saying that Mr. Gamble IS one of those destructive powerful people and that THIS VIDEO is a load of brainwashing new age cultish nonsense. If you believe in this stuff, at least in how it's presented here, you are the ignorant one. Terribly so.

  • bluetortilla

    You wouldn't have to pay him anything because if it were true they'd all be free by now. Or we'd have blown ourselves up already with the stuff.
    I love the scene of the peaceful neighborhood with the humming 'free' energy module providing for everyone's needs without any temptation to abuse it. Suuuure.......
    Energy on tap would require a society far more evolved than ours to withstand the pressure or a draconian energy authority via government to regulate it.
    One thing is true- industry would be all over free energy if it were real. Such is the 'climate of competitive egotism.' Don't believe Gamble- the oil industry may be powerful but it ain't THAT powerful. It would buckle in no time in the face of truly free energy. In fact, in some parts of the world it is already starting losing out to solar panels. Give it time, keep the pressure, and stay away from snake oilers like Gamble!

  • bluetortilla

    I share a lot of your sentiments but I am of the belief that the elite get blamed unilaterally for everything while the oppressed just sit around in ignorance eating potato chips.
    We who are not of the elite have a responsibility to educate ourselves and break free on the fears being imposed upon us. We gave the king his title, and we can take it away. You are just as much a leader, in fact a far better leader, than any of the miserably overwealthy.
    The primary and worst addictions in this world are money and power. Break your chains to those and you have changed the world. It's not so hard.

  • dalepro59

    One thing all can be assured of is this: Most every politician on the planet is a lying scamming bought and paid for scumbag. They all work for the banks and corporations. Bankers and corporate Execs are interested in making you a slave. That is all.

  • Bett Häschen

    does anyone know where the person at 2:15 is from...I have never seen anyone so beautiful

  • 11BenJamiin11

    Mr. Gamble is a man who, in my opinion, is trying to effect positive change. He is asking nothing from you. He is sharing his opinion about the problems and trying to show possible solutions. He is trying to do something good, I really don't understand why you would have such an aversion to somebody trying to effect positive change.. As for your argument that abundant energy would make the world a chaos ridden mayhem ride, I'm sorry, but it is ludacris... With abundance most people would eat better, be more creative, share more, be heaalthier.. With abundance the world would be a better place... I really don't understand people like you.

  • Indian-Homie

    Love it!! This may become the most important documentary ever made if the World continues on it's current path.

  • Ai G

    i completely agree. He may be from the Maasai tribe in Northern Kenya or Tanzania.

  • ss63ritchie .

    I was just thinking the exact same thing. The truth of the matter here is that we all are so intent on concentrating on the matters that we disagree on. What would happen if we all concentrated on the matters that we agree on. OMG! We actually may start thriving in some areas together! Wait!...are those wheels turning I hear?