The Cleantech Future

2012, Environment  -   56 Comments
Ratings: 8.04/10 from 54 users.

What if we could live in a clean world? A world in which energy would be 100% renewable, water no longer polluted, transportation truly green and production methods clean and regenerative?

There will be such a world. In this documentary VPRO Backlight explores the unprecedented possibilities of a new industrial revolution: Cleantech.

Signs of a new future are visible everywhere, from China to the US and from Europe to Thailand. Green mobility powered by sustainable energy, clean drinking water for all thanks to nanotechnology, dyeing textiles using recycled CO2.

All of this is possible and is happening successfully now! Working together with Cleantech founder Nick Parker, this film shows what our world will be like in the decades to come. VPRO Backlight travels the world in search of a clean future.

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56 Comments / User Reviews

  1. Gypsi

    This is a great documentary :D

  2. jillzzzz

    Even clean technology should be reusing everything we use. Humanity only needs food, water, clothing and shelter to survive. Sustainability equals survival. We need to do more than survive, we need to provide the basics for every single person. Anything other than the above will prove fatal for future generations. Technology will not solve our basic needs today or tomorrow.

  3. Zack Ostrow

    We're not running out of energy, just fossil fuels.

    When you think about the how much energy is produced by the sun in one day, or how much energy lies in the earths mantle, you see that it isn't a lack of energy that's the problem; it's a lack of technology that can efficiently harness those virtually limitless sources of energy.

    If we could improve the technology of harnessing just these two renewable sources of energy alone, we could produce enough energy to power the entire world cleanly for centuries.

    Unfortunately, we've already invested an enormous amount of money and blood into oil. It seems as though we are addicted to it and the lifestyle it helps to support.

    My concern is that the technology and innovation necessary to create the clean renewable energy we need will be dominated by the sheer might and greed of the oil empire. Compared to oil now, there's no money in renewable energy; just a lot of investment without an immediate return.

    The inevitable scarcity of oil and other fossil fuels will no doubt raise prices, and thus profits for the oil mogul. But, as a result, will lead to lower quality of living, degradation of society, and wars fought over resources.
    Sustainability seems to be the enemy of the corporation as it is not rapid growth. You see things like planned obsolescence and constant expansion and it shows how much money can be made as a result of building things that aren't made to last.

    The corporation does not take into account the social impact of what it's doing, i.e. destroying the ecosystems, polluting our food and water, using up more resources than we have.
    I'm afraid that those with a stake in the massive loss of profits will do everything they can to keep us hooked on oil.
    Increasingly, I am led to believe that the people will have to demand the change we want to see. The corporations won't change on their own.

    What frustrates me most is how complacent our society seems to be. Either we can't see the writing on the wall or worse, we do see it, but are either ignoring it or are too lazy to fix it. We'd rather spend our time watching Miley Cyrus do something ridiculous, or fixate on a murder trial, or on sports, or any number of diversions. We don't stop to think about what we're doing to our world or about what really matters in life (not enough of us anyway it seems).

    It also worries me how much we consume. At our current rate of consumption we will run out of resources a lot sooner than we think. We really don't need all the things we have. If we really thought about it I bet we'd find that most of it is just plain unnecessary and wasteful.

    Our cultural value system is completely dysfunctional. The things we appreciate; the things we value... it's mostly just stuff; materialistic diversions, devoid of soul and drawing attention from what is truly import in life. We're certainly going to have to adapt our lifestyle to suit the future we've created for ourselves.

    If we want to see real change happen it can't be just some of us; we all have to demand a better future than the one we're leaving for our children. We have to demand better from ourselves individually. We need to stop and think about what we want, what we don't want, and what we really need.

    Once we recognize what's going on and begin to see the path we're
    going down, we don't think we can do anything about it. We think 'I
    don't know how to fix it, it's gotten so out of hand', or we think, 'someone else will take care of it, I don't care'...
    Your voice matters. Your opinion mattes. It's your world; don't leave it to someone else to fix the problems you see. Do what you can to fix them.

    I believe it could be as easy as starting a conversation. Raise your voice and witness a global dialogue emerge as more and more people take part in the conversation. Soon words and ideas will set forth the action required to fix the problem.
    I believe we are already a part of that dialogue.

    Despite my many concerns, I have a great deal of hope. I believe the change we need to see will occur; slowly at first, but more rapidly in years to come.

    The internet allows us to communicate in a way like never before. It will be the bond that ties us together and the tool we use to unify our voices.

    Once more the people will rise to the occasion and seize the future that must come. Failure is unacceptable; we mustn't allow it.

    Very soon we will begin to see a cultural shift; a new philosophy towards our world. It will change the way we choose to exist in the world, how we relate to the environment and to each other, and will undoubtedly usher in a time of unparallelled prosperity. Together we can accomplish all of this and much more.

    1. johnBas5

      Renewable sources last for how long the sun lasts, not centuries but kinda forever.
      A sun lasts a few billion years.

  4. Sean Douglas

    Can i say indoctrination.This is the new world order.Watch iron mountain report.And we have lots of oil they dont want you to know about.Keep prices high and the fear factor they global warming crap from fossil fuels.If any warming is happening its from the greenhouse effect they created with chemtrails and h.a.a.r.p..But have the u.n. in each arm take a globalist with them and leave my countries republic alone.A nd we will be good tenants of the land.Try going after the big corporate polluter's not going to happen they own these environmental groups.this whole site is a propaganda tool for the off shore banking eliTes wake up people they control mostv all medis.and create the realality most live in based on consenous not science.its a predetermend out come And make you feeel you had a say in it the

  5. Marcel

    Yeah unfortunately even oil is not as simple as drilling a hole in the sand anymore.... It's getting dirtier and dirtier and requires heavier and heavier investments. Plus I for one like to imagine a clean world, why can't the oppressors at big oil just oppress us cleanly ... What if I still pay 300 bucks a month for solar electrically powered car instead of gas haha

  6. ms1118

    LMAO!! You know what "our" problem is (meaning ALL the comments below)? We over intellectualize everything. You are all thinking WAY too hard.
    I live in the US, in the great state of Maine. I was not born here, I moved here on purpose, and you'll get it if you are listening.
    I am low-income. I am disabled. I had no money to invest. I did the research, found an affordable "fixer-upper", and while fixing it up integrated the currently available mainstream tech, supplies AND old world tech and supplies. In this part of the world there is no piblic utilities such as natural gas etc. There is phone, electric and thats it. It's COLD here, and virtually every home is independently heated with DIESEL, at 4 bucks a gallon! Most homes use between 600 to 1200 gallons a year. Do the math.

    In 10 years, I have completely restored this antique farmhouse. To look at it you'd think its a museum or something...but the tech is there. 100% power by solar. 75% hot water from solar 20% heat-pump, 100% heat from a sustainable woodlot, high end insulation, properly placed skylighting etc. Oh to be sure I have a fuel burning furnace, and grid power...but these are only present as back-up.
    I have a Jeep, but we only run to the village once a month, it's 8 miles away. We raise a few chickens, a milk goat, a few sheep...we have a few fruit trees, berries,and a veg garden, and we trade lambs for organic beef and pork, so we have all the food we need for the year. We also sell wool, which pays for property taxes, feed additives if needed.

    I did not do this with any kind of financing, we own our little farm completely and everything on it, and it's all insured. We are 90% self-sufficient, and we only "work" on the farm a couple hours a day.
    We do have bills to pay...just like you. We have all the modern crap i.e., flat screen Tv, microwave, etc. (though we've hidden them from direct view.) But our food heat and power are all clean and derived from current sunshine. Oh right....the monthly nut to crack (totally inclusive of taxes, ins etc) is roughly 300 bucks a month.

    Does this sound like the stone age to you? Does this sound like we've made a lot of "sacrifices"? I'm typing this comment via high-speed connection on a laptop...the ONLY thing you have that I don't is a cellphone, not because I can't afford it or whatever, but because I can't imagine a more invasive product...I don't want to talk to folks while I garden, shop, or make love...I'm busy dammit.
    On the other hand I have MUCH, MUCH more than do you.

    While you are all walking and talking your OPINIONS...which are not based on experiential FACTS, but assimilated through the opinions of others, I have been quietly building a life that makes sense,

    So I am gonna go back inside my 6 bdrm 4 bth 2500 sq ft home now, I'm gonna poor myself another glass of my wife's DELICIOUS home-made wine, and relax...because that too, more than anything else I can do...because as long as the sun may shine, I and mine...will have all they need.

    But you all go just never mind my interruption...

    1. bumpercrop

      During WWII, U.S.Americans collectively grew as much food in backyard "Victory Gardens" as the farming industry. During the Great Depression, many urban dwellers faired well because they were related to people who lived on rural farms.
      Grow as much of your own food as possible and share the harvest with your neighbors. If you live in an apartment setting,community gardening could be a viable solution. There is no technology that will substitute the importance of knowing how to grow your own food or
      how to secure access to fresh water.

    2. John Champion

      hhahah great! Im doing the same next year, although i wont use solar ill try to make something for electricity..a little project. And couldnt agree more about cell phones! hahahha you probably have(had) the same feeling when it rings or beeps for messages... :D

  7. UnclearFizzyCyst

    All very nice and rosy. Currently we consume 85 odd million barrels of oil per day. The US and Russia have already pre-positioned themselves around the major oilfields. China has 'leapfrogged' this disaster and anticipated the next by buying up the agricultural produce of most of Africa. Peak oil has probably already passed by, what remains is dirtier and more expensive to extract. High tech isn't going to be able to replace that amount of energy no matter what we do. Now all we can do is sit and wait ...

  8. PeSO821

    even if we descover something cheaper than oil (which is very very hard), it will take a lot of time, before we implement those technologies
    so - nuclear would be good option for in-between!
    unfortunately it has huge PR problems.
    mostly because people do not understand the real risks:
    how many people died in Chernobyl and Fukushima?
    how many people die from respiratory disease from coal powered plants, not to mention global warming...?
    check the numbers if you do not believe me!

    1. a_no_n

      I did check...31 people died in Cherynoble, and nobody died at Fukushima.
      The vast ammount of deaths attributed to Cherynoble were not done so with any accuracy...Anyone who contracted cancer, or suffered a defect in the area had it instantly attributed to Cherynoble, whether it was the case or not! Wghich is why we have the unbelievable half a million figure that's bandied about so carelessly these days.

      The reason people don't understand nuclear energy is because well meaning but ultimately foolish people unwittingly spread lies and misinformation!
      They watch the first season of homer bumbling about on the simpsons and think They're experts on how nuclear energy works.

      Perhaps if people actually researched things, and got their science from scientists rather than Greenpeace leafleteers public understanding would be better

    2. Stephen Smith

      Seriously the Belarus Academy of Sciences are so careless! Who knew?
      And the New York Academy of sciences! How unscientific...

    3. a_no_n

      you read those reports cover to cover did you? Or are you just referencing whatever Bits greenpeace have quoted to you out of context?

    4. Stephen Smith

      I read enough of both to grasp the studies.

    5. Kristjan H

      I very much doubt so.
      Anyone who is afraid of nuclear power knows very little of it.
      Today's reactors are built unimaginably safe. What happened in Chernobyl was MANY human errors combined, which should never have happened.
      The previous generations had multiple levels of protection already, but in Chernobyl they were testing the reactor (pushing it) AND at the same time ignored all the signs of the impending failure of the reactor core, which led to the disaster that everyone now speaks of.

    6. johnBas5

      The reactor design was s*it too! But s*it according to the soviet standards of the time!
      It shouldn't have been built according to soviet style regulations.

    7. Salman Al Belushi

      this is a silly comparison, how can you compare two nuclear plants with hundredss of thousands of coal plants? if there was as many nuclear plants as coals plants with the risk of exploding or leakages then the whole world would be screwed there are plenty of alternative enerygy options we have but the corporate world wants whats easiest and most profitable. the transition will take a long time because there is not enough effective pressure from countries to turn to the green way,

    8. Tobias MacRobie

      funny thing about chernobyl.. it actually saved a lot of species from going extinct by way of creating an exclusion zone (off limits to humans). Yep, it's a bold statement, but a nuclear core meltdown and subsequent explosion results in.. nature preserve! Humans, by contrast, are more destructive to the natural world than a nuclear power plant meltdown and core breech. just by living, even if it's "green" or "sustainable", or whatever. Just by being a human, and living culturally, we are the most destructive force in nature. Go figure. So who cares how many humans die, I am more worried about the ones that live! They are scary things.

  9. Thirasak Pakhampruek

    The should put the venus project on here, it show a lot of the structure that might be the future

  10. terrasodium

    Perhaps if we all moved to a singularity of words,thoughts ,actions and habits our characters would "materialize" into the Uniting of all Nations, and our "collective" destiny could be plotted out to this realization as early as 2045. Dialectic schematic? This may appear "idealist"(insert neo-lingistics here) ,but it is our "evolutionary" destiny.

    The Gods of the Copybook Headings

    AS I PASS through my incarnations in every age and race,
    I make my proper prostrations to the Gods of the Market Place.
    Peering through reverent fingers I watch them flourish and fall,
    And the Gods of the Copybook Headings, I notice, outlast them all.

    We were living in trees when they met us. They showed us each in turn
    That Water would certainly wet us, as Fire would certainly burn:
    But we found them lacking in Uplift, Vision and Breadth of Mind,
    So we left them to teach the Gorillas while we followed the March of Mankind.

    We moved as the Spirit listed. They never altered their pace,
    Being neither cloud nor wind-borne like the Gods of the Market Place,
    But they always caught up with our progress, and presently word would come
    That a tribe had been wiped off its icefield, or the lights had gone out in Rome.

    With the Hopes that our World is built on they were utterly out of touch,
    They denied that the Moon was Stilton; they denied she was even Dutch;
    They denied that Wishes were Horses; they denied that a Pig had Wings;
    So we worshipped the Gods of the Market Who promised these beautiful things.

    When the Cambrian measures were forming, They promised perpetual peace.
    They swore, if we gave them our weapons, that the wars of the tribes would cease.
    But when we disarmed They sold us and delivered us bound to our foe,
    And the Gods of the Copybook Headings said: "Stick to the Devil you know."

    On the first Feminian Sandstones we were promised the Fuller Life
    (Which started by loving our neighbour and ended by loving his wife)
    Till our women had no more children and the men lost reason and faith,
    And the Gods of the Copybook Headings said: "The Wages of Sin is Death."

    In the Carboniferous Epoch we were promised abundance for all,
    By robbing selected Peter to pay for collective Paul;
    But, though we had plenty of money, there was nothing our money could buy,
    And the Gods of the Copybook Headings said: "If you don't work you die."

    Then the Gods of the Market tumbled, and their smooth-tongued wizards withdrew
    And the hearts of the meanest were humbled and began to believe it was true
    That All is not Gold that Glitters, and Two and Two make Four
    And the Gods of the Copybook Headings limped up to explain it once more.

    As it will be in the future, it was at the birth of Man
    There are only four things certain since Social Progress began.
    That the Dog returns to his Vomit and the Sow returns to her Mire,
    And the burnt Fool's bandaged finger goes wabbling back to the Fire;

    And that after this is accomplished, and the brave new world begins
    When all men are paid for existing and no man must pay for his sins,
    As surely as Water will wet us, as surely as Fire will burn,
    The Gods of the Copybook Headings with terror and slaughter return!

    Rudyard Kipling

  11. Imightberiding

    At aprox the 5:00 mark, did the narrator say: "Nick Parker, inventor of the term Cleantec? Heck, I used to be cool & have "invented" many terms over the years.

    Because this guy made some obvious observations & coined a phrase for a start-up & began an investment company does that mean he "invented" the concept or idea? Seems to me he took advantage of a smart idea on the wave of a trend & has made millions from it. Good for him.

  12. Friso Woudstra

    Backlight (or in Dutch 'Tegenlicht') is the best informational television program we have. Recommended.

  13. southab403

    This is one of the best, optimistic films I’ve seen in a long time about the future direction of human ingenuity and survival on this stressed planet.

    There are a host of films about how we are going down the toilet re: modern economics and how they work vs a decent life for most: the vast majority cry dooms-day. Either that or get off your butt and build your house out of discarded junk and grow a garden.

    This is a film that shows that there are numerous people working on the problems of how to be more sustainable on the planet. Does it really matter if a microcosm of society stops polluting? Of course it does! It helps in small steps on a large planet. It matters that we can now dye cloth producing a miniscule amount of pollutants. It matters that someone living in the desert can make clean water.

    If a person can’t take hope from small positive steps towards a better future, what can we take hope from?

    China is the perfect country to test out the ‘sustainable city’ ideal featured in films such as “The Venus Project”. Right now, China is building Mega-cities, but they could probably be convinced to try out the experiment in some of the more remote and poorest corners of the country. I think that there, in rural China, it would be a success. I’m quite hesitant to think it would be successful in the ‘first’ world unless there was a massive breakdown of society that precluded and forced it into existence.

  14. Luyang Han

    Seems most of VPRO docs come with prejudice, and this one particular tastes like PR from some investment company.

    1. DG550

      Using the the words "collective" and "sustainable" sounds like this is a promotion for the UN Agenda 21 program.

  15. Likejuice

    Humanity has it all wrong. There is nothing wrong with growing your own food, building your own house and making your own wine. I don't need smart phones with maps, I know where I'm going. I won't need a car while I'm busy sustaining my life at home/ Sure, keep science to the stars so that one day if we hope to survive the suns burp we can move to another planet but, until then ....

    Ya ya this isn't the 16th century, but still.

    1. Paul Gloor

      I agree, we need to take a social step backwards and see what we have done and are doing. I think this green technology revolution might carry that in parcel with the novel 'green' and energy efficient home designs to hydroponic and airponic systems. Too bad city regulations might not let someone implement some of the truly novel ones like geodesic, recycled materials and geothermal energy.

  16. brianrose87

    Its nearly universally true that clean tech/ renewable energy docs ignore EROEI (Energy Returned On Energy Invested). Basically, our industrial lifestyles are subsidized by the fact that oil, coal, and natural gas take a small INVESTMENT OF ENERGY to yield a huge RETURN ON ENERGY. (I used caps to explicate the relation to the term EROEI... not as yelling).

    A single gallon of gasoline contains the equivalent of 500 hours of hard human labor. If you don't believe me just put a gallon of gas in your vehicle, drive it until it stalls, and push it back to the gas station. How long did pushing a 1,500 lb vehicle 30 miles take you? Probably about 500 hours. You could also do this by counting the amount of kilojoules of energy in a gallon of gas, and comparing it to kilojoules (calories) burned pushing the vehicle.

    We use fossil fuels because they are the most energy dense and easy to access form of energy available to humanity.

    For everyone whose blood started boiling when they read that, keep in mind we are on the same side. When including the externalized costs of pollution, CO2 emissions, etc. fossil fuels are more costly to our future, but those costs are not legally put into dollars and cents. Regardless, if they were the energy you buy would be vastly more expensive, which means a lower standard of living.

    Before we burned fossil fuels we road on horses, 95% of the population was farmers (mechanization aka oil freed humans from that), and the population was less than 1 billion. It is not a coincidence that the moment Homo sapiens began exploiting fossil fuels its population exploded, a middle class formed, machines allowed people freetime to invent and diversify job opportunities, etc.

    It is not a coincidence that our entire global industrial civilization was created in direct correlation to our exploitation of fossil fuels. Humans today are no smarter than 2,000 years ago, we just have an abundant, energy dense, yet finite source of energy.

    What happens when our ability to extract our limited sources of fossil fuels begins to wane? Can clean energy provide us enough energy to maintain highly complex, energy intensive lifestyles? The science says no. The science says that this energy bonanza we have experienced over the last 250 years is a one time gift of geology. Enjoy the ride, and apologize to your grandchildren.

    1. Paul Gloor

      All the more reason to start researching, implementing and supplementing our energy systems now in novel ways before we hit that fossil fuel crunch and things become expensive and/or down right impossible.

    2. Luyang Han

      Completely agree. Only problem is that if the ability favored by the fossil fuel offers us enough time to explore new energy sources.

    3. t33to

      I'm guessing we'll have to adjust our values at some point and learn to enjoy living with less junk and less energy intensive lives.

  17. dmxi

    first the cleansing has to start at the top of the foodchain & then the rest will fall into place....a social (r)evolution,if you will.

  18. Matt Kukowski

    Never gonna happen... civil war will happen. The oil companies worship Satan and the all mighty falling a part dollar. These people will have to go... and they have TRILLIONS to buy military weapons and police. So, the race is on... hopefully the amount of people involved in conspiracies is low enough for the rest of the world to over come them. But, it is hard to say.

    There is NO NEED for electric cars... I mean I am for them... but look up Stan Meyer and his water car that can power ANY combustible engine with pure water... no storage of hydrogen needed and you get the water from the rain off your roof or just take a piss in your 'gas' tank to get a few more miles.

    YouTube Stan Meyer water car

    1. Fabien L

      Stan Meyer's water fueled car was a fraud. It contradicts the laws of thermodynamics. He never let real scientists examine his "invention" and was forced to reimburse 2 investors by an Ohio court.

    2. Matt Kukowski

      Well Japan already sells generators and cars that run on water. Ask them.

    3. Jack1952

      Ask the entire country if they have water powered cars? Why don't you direct us to where you got this information? Better yet, show me where I can buy one of these cars. Your statement means nothing. Back it up. We are not going to accept it based solely on you say so.

    4. brianrose87

      Water isn't an energy source. You'll be interested to know that a molecule of H2O weighs less than just the hydrogen and oxygen its made from. This is possible because of E=mc^2.

      Breaking a molecule of water requires an input of energy that is never recovered. The input energy is literally transformed into mass. We know, because of physics, that it is impossible to power anything from water because it is not an energy source. In fact, it requires an input of energy to perform hydrolysis. Catalysts only reduce the threshold required to perform hydrolysis. Even with a catalyst, an unrecoverable energy input is still required.

      Fossil fuels are an energy source (they combust spontaneously) because mass is converted into energy when the carbon hydrogen bond is broken (the opposite of breaking apart water). This is why octane and methane are flammable and water is not, its physics, its chemistry, its the fundamental laws of nature.

      Fat molecules are non-polar because they are simply a bunch of carbon hydrogen bonds. Carbon hydrogen bonds are the source of energy in sugar and carbohydrates. The chemistry that fuels your body and keeps you alive is the same chemistry that makes fossil fuels (carbon-hydrogen bonds) useful.

      Water as an energy source is literally, 100% impossible. If any video claims otherwise it is deceiving you. We know the physical and chemical nature of these molecules and know the exact weights, energy contents, various isotopes, isotope frequency, etc. I cannot stress enough that if you took even an introductory Chemistry course in college you would not believe that water can be an energy source. Its not rocket science, its Chemistry 101... literally.

    5. I AM POP SLAG.

      LENR on the other hand increases the weight or atomic particles to release energy, actually transmuting one metal into another- a few tweaks in stabilising the reaction and we have an almost inexhaustible energy source...
      those few tweaks being a little more difficult than i have made out but some companies are making great claim to advance the technique to a viable technology....incidentally they are all seemingly obsessed with profit and in the process prove that we dont deserve such a wonderful technology because we are greedy self serbving scum on the most part and if we wipe ourselves out maybe the chimps will do better and not need so many f****** lightbulbs.

    6. Jack1952

      There are no LENR devices that stand up to peer review or meets the standards of scientific review. There is no scientific model that explains how or why such a device would work. The profit motive proves that this wonderful technology does not exist, at least not yet. The potential for huge profit would have such a device on the market, on sale, for money, to a public eager for a cheaper energy source. The operative word being "cheaper" in a public that will profit from a better energy source and an economy that would profit by having to spend less on its energy needs.

      Yours is a misanthropic view of society which leads you to see conspiracies everywhere. It's a them versus us(me) paranoia.

    7. invient

      The LENR phenomena is in fact real. Yes, one can argue if a device has been created to exploit it, but there is verifiable repeated proof that something other than chemical reactions is taking place.

      For instance, see the co-deposition spawar experiments. There is also an employee at NASA that is pursuing lenr. The MFMP group is reproducing the celani experiment.

      There is the widom-larsen theory which requires no new physics, and explains the phenomena.

    8. Jack1952

      Whatever is going on in those experiments has not been consistently repeatable. That has been the problem with cold fusion since Pons and Fleischmann made their claims back in 89. Reproducibility is the cornerstone of the scientific method and experiments continue to give conflicting results, which is why main stream science has doubted the claims made by the cold fusion researchers.

      The widom-larsen theory is one of many ideas that try to explain what is going on in these experiments. How can you have a theory to explain something when results have been inconsistent? For it to be an accurate description you have to have a phenomena that is recognizable and is accurately predictable. Nothing about cold fusion has been predictable as of yet. They have to keep researching and in the end it may lead nowhere. Also, predictable results would have given us a usable energy source by now. After twenty five years plus of research and still nothing that anyone is using or demonstrating. Cell phone technology started at the same time and look how far it has gone in the same time frame.

    9. I AM POP SLAG.

      ??? where did i claim conspiracy you clown???
      Its not a case of them versus me its a case of the 5% of critically thinking people who are massively outnumbered by a huge majority of very s***** group thinking sheepfolk whos opinion can be swayed by a well placed media campaign and whos psyches are as ,alleable as playdoh- just pick a random person on the street and you will get the idea.
      Lenr and its excess heat reactions have been studied ,featured in peer reviewed papers and are proven to work- we dont fully understand the processes involved but the PEER REVIEWED PAPER BY WIDOM AND LARSEN on the subject is a very interesting and viable piece of science.
      There is very good evidence that some of the current crop of devices do work and indeed will hit the market as soon as the reaction can be controlled- for that it needs to be understood properly...
      so wind your neck in jack and slurp up your oil like a good little consumer.
      Optimism is often akin to delusion- in fact i can point you in the direction of a psychology paper that goes a long way in proving this- its peer reviewed if that really bothers you so much, but so are the fraudulent studies pushed into journals by pharmaceutical industries, oil companies and the politically motivated.

      any true scientific mind can discern the validity of a paper whether it is peer reviewed or not using scientific analysis and basic fact checking or primarily by using the real key to validating science -that of reproducibility.

    10. Jack1952

      You claim you do not espouse conspiracy theories but you claim fraud when referring to studies published into scientific journals. A fraud implies conspiracy. You call ninety five percent of the people sheepfolk...another term used by the conspiracy folk. I would assume that you do not include yourself as one of the sheepfolk.

      All of us benefit from cheap and convenient oil...including you. It has allowed for a mobility of people and products unprecedented in human history. It allowed the economic backdrop that gave us the computer technology so we can bicker back and forth through cyberspace. It has allowed a comfort for many of us that was only a dream a century ago.

      You can belly ache all you want about oil company excesses but their ability to use oil for their huge profits is limited. The oil fields are running out and when most of it is gone the power of the large oil companies will also dwindle.

      As for me being a good little consumer. Yes, I am. I am using it right now to keep warm. Very important as I look out and see the ten inches of snow that fell overnight. My grandkids are warm. We are not struggling to keep the ravages of a northern winter from killing them. I will continue to use oil and oil by products until something better comes along. You see, I am not addicted to oil. I am grateful for the lifestyle that oil has made available to me but I don't use it because I have been programmed to use oil and only oil. I use it because it is relatively cheap, versatile and efficient. Actually, the same reason that you do.

    11. I AM POP SLAG.

      fraud generally is, by its very nature, pretty conspiratorial-
      Its the nature of the beast- with conspiracy to defraud being a criminal offence but somehow one that is allowed to go on unpunished rather often in this consumer culture we live in.

      A bit like murder by police officers- when they kill in the line of duty its considered very differently from normal murder.

      The big conspiracy is that of our own language and an unwillingness to admit the truth of how we behave toward one another.

      When it comes to greed and deception if you are poor its called theft or fraud, when your rich all manner of terms andf excuses are used to obfuscate the truth of matters in an act of mass wilful self delusion.
      So deception, theft and fraud becomes "rehypothecated collateralised debt obligations", counterfeiting becomes "quantitative easing" and thats just the money system.
      The problem we face is coming to terms with our own greedy demons that personify themselves in the zuckerburgs and megalomaniacs of this world who end up wielding huge amounts of power with scant regard for the consequences and in reality an inability to manage the resources they accumulate.
      Thios whole concept of "ownership" is what needs addressing.
      Facebook for instance -its worth is in the fact it is "owned" by the thousands of people who use it- but its users will refer to zuckerburg as some sort of honorary plantation owner and accept their place as serfs in HIS world when in reality zuckerburg only has all this power because everyone lets him- or lets the ceo of BP make an engineering decision to use cheap concrete because thats just how the system is set up-
      s*upid is the game of the day
      im not one to espouse conspiracy theories but if the evidence is there im not one to be so naive to think we arent totally beset by thought processes that are the very anathema to anything good at all and we conspire ourselves to keep it that way as ignorance is of course blissful which is why you manage to stay so happy i expect.
      And wheteher youlike it or not some people do very well from the staus quo being the staus quo and have ,do and will again actively conspire to keep it that way.
      im sure you bhave a lovely life but wilful naivete is not something that sits easy with me.
      The real biggie is the question as to whether we are going to accept humanities decision to truly commit mass suicidenow we have dominated the ecosphere to such an extent we have.
      THis is it- change our ways no or get dragged screaming into the night by our own reproiductive organs.
      This conspiracy was set in place many years ago and has been shored up over the years with tactics as banale and everyday as heating ones house or letting someone run a nuclear facility with profit as the goal.
      To allow an organisation such as tepco to run fukushima in the first instance is a huge conspiracy of s*upidity in itself...
      We dont need theories -the conspiracies are as plain as the nose on your face...The sad reality being my and your very existence as one of the 7 billion strong swarm of apes inhabiting this ball is a conspiracy against the future of mankind unless we actually consider now what challenges our progeny will face in a thousand years time or even a hundred years.
      Im optimistic only that our lifestyle now will be held in the future as a model for how easy and wonderful and amazing our lives could be if we were to do something as profound or unorthodox as a whole species - try not to have any more babies for a a year?
      see how it goes?
      collectively as a species if we were to just accept the truth of the matter and look at the numbers we would behave very differently-
      We do not however think this way...yet individually at least, thats the hope though- If you think about it... or rather... think about us- i mean ALL OF US- I MEAN F*&K! 7 f*cking billion! and we all want a car each! right? of course we f*cking do! but 7 billion! S*IT!
      Oh and about all that stockpiled nuclear waste and weaponry WTF are we going to do about that?
      There is nothing more insane in the universe than building a device like that in a finite and contained environment then sitting next to it smugly like you acheived something.
      It would be nice to maybe consider for a moment if there was more to life than just our world then it might be a better place to be what the pervading sense of impending doom that saturates every moment inour existence. you remember that look on your parents face dont you?
      that one, that look troubled that, the loom that took a while to set into your own.
      As if ever since you were born there was a tiger in the room that is the ultimate taboo, brought up on stories of a great war that breezes over the thing that ended it and should have ended all wars.
      We are all in the same boat , an ever shrinking one WITHA F*CKING TIGER!
      When did we agree to this?
      DId we have a meeting?
      Whats that? No? Yoiu say we all consensually agreed to live under the threat oif this thing for a while to see if sheer absolute, all encompassing, unending, ever vigilkant pure unmitigated hot fiery terror of your own species' self inflicted demise not only as a human but as an entire species will somehow make you change your misguided priorities as a species?
      Its not working- humanity has responded in a mannaer akin to ecological disaster in the face of having built a device that would destroy everything we know- what works for volcanoes and ice ages doesnt quite cut it in the face of pure unmitigated permanent fear.
      God will prevail- What other hope is there when you live next door to hell and leave the garden gate wide open- not old branded bulls*it robes and ritual god. but actual collective consensus dismantling god of careful nuclear waste containment management and most importantly disarmament- as long as any man wields a device like that our insanity is confirmed- as long as someone somewhere is wielding a nuke then we are all effectively holding ourselves to ransom and cannot possibly in any circumstances solve anyhting- its like putting a gun to your head to learn how not to pull the trigger of a gun pointed to your head.

    12. iconerror

      I agree with most of your post but, (there's always a but), I disagree with your polemic conclusion that the world cannot sustain 8 billion people. The same power mongers that have set up the system we live in are the same who pay for studies that conclude the earths population is too large for the earth. That is one of the biggest lies these oligarchs are perpetrating. Reducing population will not remove greed and deception. The key lies in peoples attitudes. We can live in a cleaner world 'yesterday' if we all cared, and with our current technology. Future tech will definitely help but it won't solve our social problems and our interactions with each other. But, I digress; I believe the only solution is God stepping in. One of the wisest men that ever lived said this: "man has dominated man to his injury." Hence, mankind will not be able to rule each other towards prosperity. So, the solution does not lie within us.

    13. Stephen Smith

      It's easier to reduce population than to change human nature. Tell you wnat, lets make serious efforts to curb population growth while we wait for you efforts to change humannature to kick in.

    14. I AM POP SLAG.

      no im sheep folk alright - we are all the same species -its just some of us take our consensus opinions from unagreed upon sources.
      mostly in the form of archaic cultural behaviour that will lead ultimately if unchecked to our own extinction.
      We have many things to transcend as our intellect has way more potential in essence than our biology- but thats where we seem to have gotten unstuck- poisoning our own wells ffs. so we can spread into a finite space- s*it if we cant even get the maths right then what the f?

    15. Paul Gloor

      On one hand, the profit motive encourages cheaper production... even if it doesn't filter down the line :(

    16. Imightberiding


    17. DigiWongaDude

      @ Brianrose87 ...respect! I read and enjoy all your posts that I come across. As with this one. I have no doubt that you are correct, but wondered about this:

      "Water isn't an energy source...Breaking a molecule of water requires an input of energy that is never recovered."

      Q: Wouldn't fish have something to say about this?

    18. brianrose87

      No hydrolysis is necessary. Water is not hydrolyzed for fish to breath (assuming this is what you are referring to). If it was the fish would have to be eating a lot more food just to breath. Evolution doesn't like inefficiency and waste, so a better method evolved in which the gills simply uptake dissolved oxygen (DO) in the water.

      This is easily tested in hypoxic or anoxic lakes. Where no dissolved oxygen is present, no fish are present; even though they have all the water to hydrolyze that they could hope for.

    19. DigiWongaDude

      @ brianrose87, that's so cool, dissolved oxygen, of course. Thanks! And there's me thinking you would say fish wouldn't say anything cause they can't talk. :)

    20. Jack1952

      Your civil war comment makes no sense. The whole world is going to have a civil war? It's a vague and illogical statement.

      The reason we use oil and oil products because it is a cheap, versatile and convenient commodity. Nothing else can touch it. Oil companies make money from it because that is how they maintain production capabilities that allow us our affluent lifestyles. If they lost money they would go bankrupt. Profit equals survival. It isn't some conspiracy. It is a reality of economics. As oil supplies dwindle, it will be more difficult to abstract this oil from the remaining fields. We will be force to look elsewhere for our energy needs and the oil companies will either change their economic strategies to other sources or disappear. A reality which has nothing to do with any conspiracy.

      Your reference to Satan is really off the wall. It sounds like something some backwoods revivalist preacher might say. A little out of touch with reality.

      Your water driven car is a myth. So are all the other free energy claims that you see on the internet. Anyone with a basic understanding of the laws of science knows this. It is not a conspiracy. It is reality. You would be doing yourself a favour by trying to acquire this basic understanding.

    21. Imightberiding

      I am thankful to those in my life who have helped me evolve into a slightly more educated man than I would have been without their "wake-up" slaps to the face.

      Mick Fraser was being gracious in his comment to you. Jack1952 was a little more forthright. Come on buddy. Time to wake up. Start reading a little more. By that I mean accredited authors & ideas proven by the scientific method. Any reading for that matter, sans internet conspiracy theories would probably be a good thing for you. Do a little research. Meet some knew friends who have perhaps graduated from college or are knowledgeable in there fields of expertise & hang out with them a little. Ask questions & listen a lot more than you talk.

      Or just relax with some good suspense fiction. Completely off topic but, Elmore Leonard & Lee Child are two of my favorites. There's often enough truth in one of their novels to help nudge a person along for the next couple days of life until you read the next novel & so on.

  19. elmer_thug

    "First" stick that in your pipe and smoke it Danial Tosh.. _!_